Umpteenth shootout in the US, this time near New York's Empire State building

[Uncle Sparky]

They may take our lives, but they'll never take our FREEEDOOOMMM!!!

You know, he was refering to the Jews.

I'd add that Vermont has the most lax gun laws in the country and crime is not a problem there.

1st Vermont is a rural/cottage country state (less crime) that borders Canada (we're a good influence).
2nd I suspect a large percentage of fire arms in Vermont are the type used for historical reenactments. I've said before, I have no problem with people owning as many muskets as they want.

[SlowwHand]

With all due respect, "I suspect" is not a viable statistical analysis.

[Lonestar]

The authors of the Constitution envisioned a small or non-existent standing army mainly consisting of regular officers and NCOs, with volunteer soldiers in wartime. That is in marked contrast to what we have now. In that scenario the 2nd amendment would unarguably be a serious check.

Buddy, the 2nd Amendment was there to swell Federal Power, not reduce it. Militias were used to suppress rebellions against the federal government, and the Feds very clearly viewed arming the populace and placing them in a militia as a net positive for federal power, not as a check.

It would be possible to revert to that mode by standing down active units and standing up lots of national guard units, but I don't know if that is actually advisable.

Why not? We do not need as large an active army or Marines as what we have. Not even close.

[Lonestar]

1st Vermont is a rural/cottage country state (less crime) that borders Canada (we're a good influence).

So? Rural areas tend to be more armed than suburban or urban areas, especially with the kinds of "military style assault weapons" that gun-control proponents crow about.

2nd I suspect a large percentage of fire arms in Vermont are the type used for historical reenactments. I've said before, I have no problem with people owning as many muskets as they want.

Interestingly, I didn't say what kind of firearms Vermonters use(although I doubt "a large percentage are a type used for historical reenactments"). I said they have the most lax gun laws in the country. In Vermont you can conceal carry without a permit, and buy pretty much anything if you can afford it and the Fedeal fee/license.

Call me crazy, but I doubt that a lot of Vermonters that are using CC are carrying flintlock musket pistols.

[Uncle Sparky]

Call me crazy,

You are CRAZY!!!

[Alexander's Horse]

I know how to use guns and I respect them too much to have a handgun in my home. Mrs Horse would have shot me by now for sure.

[regexcellent]

Why not? We do not need as large an active army or Marines as what we have. Not even close.

Obviously this is true. I'm just unsure if it's a cost effective way to draw down the force by transforming active formations into guard formations. My first inclination is that it would be.

I think it's probably much more politically doable than straight-up cutting the total (active+reserve) size of the force dramatically, especially since there are winners at the state government level. The military is probably the biggest hunk of pork in the federal budget, what with all those unnecessary bases and procurements. Changing it faces a lot of resistance.

[The Mad Monk]

Good example of concealed carry in action.

Armed customer shoots dollar store robber, killing him

By NBC News staff
A Jacksonville, Fla., dollar store customer shot and killed a robber Monday night, ActionNewsJax.com reported.


Follow @NBCNewsUSAccording to the report, the customer -- a 57-year-old grandfather -- and two store employees were inside the Dollar General store Monday around 9 p.m. when two armed men entered the store with the intention to rob it.

"One of them had the clerk and one of them was at the front cash register,” Lt. Rob Schoonover of the Jacksonville Sheriff’s Office told Jacksonville.com.

Advertise | AdChoicesThe customer, who has a concealed weapon permit, shot and killed one of the intruders, FirstCoastNews.com reported.

"There was a citizen who had a concealed firearms permit that was inside the store as a customer," Lt. Schoonover told WOKV.com. "He fired at the suspect, striking him and killing him."

The man was found dead when police arrived at the scene. No charges are pending against the shooter, WOKV.com said.

“He’s always been a marksman,” the man's wife told Jacksonville.com. “He shoots in competitions, but this is the first time he’s ever killed anyone and I don’t know how he’ll handle that.”

The second suspect fled the scene in a small SUV, FirstCoastNews.com reported. Police say the man is about 6 feet tall man and was wearing khaki pants, a blue bandana and black gloves, ActionNewsJax.com reported.

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/08/28/13526604-armed-customer-shoots-dollar-store-robber-killing-him?lite

[giblets]

So you can shoot someone who is robbing someone else's store without repercussions? Awesome

[kentonio]

Genuine question, if he'd missed and killed the shopkeeper, or hit the robber but the bullet had passed through and killed the shopkeeper, would he face charges?

[The Mad Monk]

x-kenton'd

If you're stuck in the same store when it's happening? Absolutely.

[The Mad Monk]

x-me'd

I do not know.

I DO know the second scenario is more likely if hollow points are banned.

[kentonio]

Isn't the first scenario also more likely if hollow points arent banned? I.E. the killing part, not the missing part.

[The Mad Monk]

Non-hollowpoints of any caliber are far more likely to go entirely through bodies, walls, sheetmetal, and glass than hollowpoints.

Substitute "robber" with "wall" and "shopkeeper" with passerby", and you will see what I mean.

[DaShi]

Good example of concealed carry in action.



http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012...lling-him?lite

You think this supports your argument?