Umpteenth shootout in the US, this time near New York's Empire State building

[OneFootInTheGrave]

Even though that people kill peple, they kill them a whole lot easier with guns, so it's the efficiency that matters most. Americans are too efficient to use some other lesser weaponry like swords, crossbows, showels, spears or hammers.

[regexcellent]

Any sensible person will realize a single city (or even a single state) cannot effectively enact gun control.

I'm sure you know this, but let's start to be intellectually honest here, okay?

This isn't targeted at you in particular, but at the several posters in this thread who have all made the same patently absurd argument.

THE WHOLE GODDAMN STATE has strict gun laws. New York City has a population roughly equal to that of Virginia. The state has 20 million people, larger than most countries and coming on 2/3rds the population of Canada. Gun control is not workable.

[Asher]

THE WHOLE GODDAMN STATE has strict gun laws.

If you would care to read my post again...I mentioned states cannot even do it.

Unless your state boundaries are equivalent to national boundaries, it just means you go to another state to buy your ****.

As for a reasonable argument...

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/two-dead-in-shooting-outside-empire-state-building/article4496590/

Nine others were hit by gunfire. Mayor Michael Bloomberg said that some of the victims may have been hit by police bullets. The victims are expected to survive.

Can you imagine the chaos if this was in some redneck town like Houston? All of those heroes carrying guns, firing off at "the shooter" and hitting far more innocents than even the trained police officers did here.

That would've been a sight to see.

[OneFootInTheGrave]

Modern day American gladiators

[regexcellent]

There isn't a documented case of a massive melee free for all of gunfighters from concealed carriers. There are loads and loads of documented cases of these things being interrupted by people with firearms. That doesn't get reported because usually only the perp is injured and things are hunky dory, thus it's not really newsworthy.

[regexcellent]

To add: concealed carry permit holders statistically have a dramatically lower frequency of homicide than the general population. That include justifiable homicide i.e. defensive gunfire.

[Asher]

There isn't a documented case of a massive melee free for all of gunfighters from concealed carriers.

That's just because there are too many cowardly democrats not packing heat, and because Republicans only pull guns on people when victory is assured (which extends to US national security policy).

[Uncle Sparky]

Americans are too fat to use weapons other then guns -

Also, Americans can only be brought down by high caliber weapons.

[Asher]

To add: concealed carry permit holders statistically have a dramatically lower frequency of homicide than the general population. That include justifiable homicide i.e. defensive gunfire.

This would indeed shock a simpleton, I'm sure.

Next you'll also tell me that the majority of concealed carry permit holders live in suburbia and are white.

But let's continue attributing the fact that they carry a concealed weapon as the reason they are below the general population rate.

Doesn't it bother you to be so blatantly disingenuous? Or are you just copying and pasting **** from the NRA page?

[regexcellent]

That's just because there are too many cowardly democrats not packing heat, and because Republicans only pull guns on people when victory is assured (which extends to US national security policy).

Okay, now you're just spouting troll bull**** rather than contributing anything meaningful.

The simple reality is that New York's border controls with adjacent states for the purposes of individuals and non-drug items is not that much more strict than controls for entering Canada. If I wanted to bring a gun into Canada, I could, and could probably sneak it past customs too, just by crossing the bridge over the Niagara River an hour away from Rochester. One more hour I'm in Hamilton. One more hour after that, I'm in Toronto.

Alternatively, you could get a gun in Michigan, which has reasonably loose gun laws, and smuggle it into Windsor. That would be just as difficult (not at all) and you could easily purchase things like "assault weapons" and concealable handguns.

Canada just doesn't have the same problem with crime that America does all around; it has nothing to do with guns.

[OneFootInTheGrave]

We knew that already. You give a gun to a Canadian and he puts it on the shelf. Give a gun to an American and he goes out and shoots people. It's all in the culture. Americans are uncivilized barbarians and that is all there is to it.

While we knew that already, it does not hurt to repeat this point, people on this site are forgetful.

[Asher]

The simple reality is that New York's border controls with adjacent states for the purposes of individuals and non-drug items is not that much more strict than controls for entering Canada. If I wanted to bring a gun into Canada, I could, and could probably sneak it past customs too, just by crossing the bridge over the Niagara River an hour away from Rochester. One more hour I'm in Hamilton. One more hour after that, I'm in Toronto.

Alternatively, you could get a gun in Michigan, which has reasonably loose gun laws, and smuggle it into Windsor. That would be just as difficult (not at all) and you could easily purchase things like "assault weapons" and concealable handguns.

What is the penalty of being caught of bringing a gun into Canada? What is the likelihood of being caught of bringing a gun into Canada?
What is the penalty of being caught bringing a gun into New York? What is the likelihood of being caught of bringing a gun into New York?

Canada just doesn't have the same problem with crime that America does all around; it has nothing to do with guns.

Keep telling yourself that. It's patently absurd to think guns don't have any role to play in your absurdly high murder rate.

You also do have many cultural problems, but many of those are the fault of the same kind of people who are pro-guns-for-everyone.

[Docfeelgood]

"If they'd rather die then perhaps they had better do so and decrease the surplus population."

[regexcellent]

Next you'll also tell me that the majority of concealed carry permit holders live in suburbia and are white.

Most Americans live in suburbia and are white. My recollection is that only about 25% of Americans live in city centers. Incidentally, that's were almost all crime occurs. Meaning that for the vast majority of Americans, the effective crime rate that they experience is very low.

[regexcellent]

What is the penalty of being caught of bringing a gun into Canada? What is the likelihood of being caught of bringing a gun into Canada?
What is the penalty of being caught bringing a gun into New York? What is the likelihood of being caught of bringing a gun into New York?

I don't know the Canadian penalties, but sneaking a banned gun in New York is generally a felony with a mandatory prison sentence. I believe that sentence is two years.