Incorporating the new secession

[Pax]

Affluent areas of counties and cities are incorporating/attempting to incorporate all over the U.S. In the northern part of metro atlanta, a new city seems be forming every 6 months to a year. The new cities usually cite that either the county or city that they were originally governed by was not meeting there needs or they the taxes they were paying were too high. This has wrecked havoc on the county budget of DeKalb and Fulton county where they then have to figure out a way to provide the same services with less money. So it ends up as making things worse in the non incorporated areas. I personally think It's selfish and short sighted for these cities to incorporate. As the crime rate goes up on the outside of your city it will also start to rise inside the city. On a personal note, I work for a county and have too consider whether or not to leave the countys' employ for job security as others have already left and also putting the county in a worse situation. I'm wondering if you guys are seeing the same things going on where you live.

[Dinner]

This is nothing new. There have been very high profile attempts by wealthy areas to break off from the larger urban areas just so they can keep the revenue from their area instead of allowing it to be used for the good of the entire area. Miami has suffered from such actions, Los Angeles is practically defined by such patch works of cities (most recently San Fernando Valley broke off because they got tired of paying for poorer areas), etc... Ironically it makes for less efficiency as it results in more duplication of effort (two sets of everything since one city becomes two) and fewer economies of scale so they have to pay more for things like police cars or fire engines.

[Pax]

http://news.yahoo.com/51st-state-small-step-forward-long-shot-south-233234624.html

[Dinner]

It will never happen in a million years. Most of the Republicans in the state are in the south and in the rural eastern parts of the state but since two out of three major urban areas are solidly Democratic (the bay area and greater L.A.) Republicans typically lose state wide races and in the odd cases where they do win they have to run a relatively liberal candidate who gets labeled a RINO by the party's mouth foamers. Republicans have wanted to cut the state in half for decades as it would mean they'd have a slight majority in the south or at least would be competitive but everyone who isn't a partisan hack hates the idea and finds it mildly treasonous.

Stone's South California would not include Los Angeles.

I mean how much more transparently retarded can he be with his gerrymandering? L.A. is the giant 10,000 lb gorilla of Southern California as greater LA is by far the largest urban area (with something like 17 million people), it's the center of trade & financing, plus it's the transportation and manufacturing hub of SoCal. Southern California without Los Angeles is like New York state without New York City. The only, and I repeat ONLY, reason that ******** Stone wanted to exclude it was because it's mostly Democratic. That carpet bagger scum can roll up his blog post and stuff it up his backside because it literally has zero chance of ever passing.

This is more interesting:

In the meantime, Stone's secession bid could lead to useful conversation on the subject of what makes California so difficult to govern.

The answer is simple and well known: the 2/3rds rule in the state legislature. If you can get 1/3 of either house to oppose something then that's it, complete grid lock and nothing gets done. The 2/3rds rule wasn't introduced until the early 1980's when Republicans swept in during Reagan's election deliberately put the 2/3rds rule in because they were tired of always losing every vote. They took advantage of their one brief majority in the legislature to insert a poison pill into the state constitution which insured they would forever after be able to veto everything they didn't like no matter how needed or how retarded their reasons were. If we get rid of the 2/3rds rule then the state will go back to being the well run show case it was before the 2/3rds rule created complete gridlock.

[Hauldren Collider]

This is almost as funny as the idea of NOVA forming its own state for all the liberal welfare queens and defense contractors.

That said I think Northern California should probably split off, California is unreasonably large. Although Sacramento's been doing a good job of fixing that, so far

[Dinner]

We should get bigger by reannexing Nevada and Baja California.

[Ben Kenobi]

This is nothing new. There have been very high profile attempts by wealthy areas to break off from the larger urban areas just so they can keep the revenue from their area instead of allowing it to be used for the good of the entire area. Miami has suffered from such actions, Los Angeles is practically defined by such patch works of cities (most recently San Fernando Valley broke off because they got tired of paying for poorer areas), etc... Ironically it makes for less efficiency as it results in more duplication of effort (two sets of everything since one city becomes two) and fewer economies of scale so they have to pay more for things like police cars or fire engines.

This is simply the reversal of the demand of cities to incorporate everything in their borders. The reality is that the cities have an insatiable desire to spend and raise property taxes and fees on everything. When it becomes cheaper for a person to literally drive their garbage to a dump in both the time cost and the inconvenience, then yeah, the city needs to take a step back.

[Ben Kenobi]

The answer is simple and well known: the 2/3rds rule in the state legislature. If you can get 1/3 of either house to oppose something then that's it, complete grid lock and nothing gets done.

Dims have a majority and still haven't been able to pass a legal budget. CA's controller (also a DIM) just curbstomped the budget. They don't need any help to pass a budget, and yet they still can't get it done.

California's problems revolve around one thing. Their democrat leadership has failed the state, and continues to fail the state.

[Pax]

Did the republican governor have anything to do with it?

[Ben Kenobi]

Did the republican governor have anything to do with it?

Moonbeam is a republican? Schwartzenegger left awhile ago,

[Dinner]

California's problems revolve around one thing. Their democrat leadership has failed the state, and continues to fail the state.

You are a dunce. Everyone knows exactly what must be done to balance the budget and eliminate the structural deficit but the 2/3rds rule prevents it from being done just as the gerrymandered districts mean both parties produce nothing but extremists in the state government (everyone knows with a 99.99% accuracy which party will win in which district so the contest that matters is the primary where the most extreme candidate wins). Luckily, in 2010 the 2/3rds rule got relaxed some what and the new redistricting rules will get rid of the worst abuses in gerrymandering (at least until the parties figure out how to game the new system) so we should see some improvement after they go into effect.

[Hauldren Collider]

California is not a real democracy right now. Not with the way things are currently gerrymandered.

[Ben Kenobi]

You are a dunce. Everyone knows exactly what must be done to balance the budget and eliminate the structural deficit

Let's see. Raise property taxes, raise sales taxes, raise income taxes. Have I got you right?

but the 2/3rds rule prevents it from being done just as the gerrymandered districts mean both parties produce nothing but extremists in the state government

T'was not the Republicans who gerrymandered, but your fellow Dims. If you don't want hardcore pubbies, don't squash their representation into one area.

You wouldn't get 2/3rds without gerrymandering either, so you're basically hosed.

Luckily, in 2010 the 2/3rds rule got relaxed some what and the new redistricting rules will get rid of the worst abuses in gerrymandering (at least until the parties figure out how to game the new system) so we should see some improvement after they go into effect.

Which is why the dims tried to pass a budget that's in massive deficit? BTW, I heard that Amazon no longer has sellers in CA. Sucks to be a third world country. Oh wait, I think even third world countries have Amazon sellers.

[Kitschum]

Balkan America. Who will be the Slovenia of the New World? Who will be the Serbia? It's all very exciting.

[Dinner]

California is not a real democracy right now. Not with the way things are currently gerrymandered.

The sad thing is both of the parties on in on it. In 2010 they passed a new redistricting proposition which provides for geographically based districts which have to be as compact as possible and try to keep cities/towns/neighborhoods all in one district where ever possible. The incumbents are all busy suing everyone they can but it looks like the courts will confirm the new districts by the next election so there should be a lot of new competitive districts in the state in 2012.