US Gun Laws

[Aeson]

And it's not apples to oranges. How the **** is % of homicides using firearms apples to oranges?

American as apple pie vs what the color of England was in Civ 3

[Hauldren Collider]

Note that his is exactly the case in the UK. And I ask you to, again, compare the UK/US statistics and tell me they are not night and day.

You're conveniently forgetting North Ireland, which has similar gun control as the rest of the UK if not stricter.

[Asher]

Hunting? Target shooting? Collecting? People like guns.
Oh yeah, self defense, there's that too

Yes, because no one hunts or does target shooting in Canada.

Collectors? Yes, by all mean let's justify the incomprehensibly high US firearm murder rate because some rich ****s like collecting guns.

self defense. Man up and stop hiding behind a gun.

[Asher]

You're conveniently forgetting North Ireland, which has similar gun control as the rest of the UK if not stricter.

Okay, so why don't you tell us what Northern Ireland's firearm murder rate is then...?

[Asher]

You're making a false comparison here...I dare you to try to see where your logic completely breaks down. Hint: it's in the post right above the one quoted in this.

It's a completely valid comparison.

Replace kiddy porn with nuclear bombs and it's the same. Your argument is absurd.

[Asher]

Okay, so why don't you tell us what Northern Ireland's firearm murder rate is then...?

Spoiler:

Firearm homicide rate per 100,000:

Northern Ireland: 0.41 (2007)
US: 2.97

% of homicides where a firearm is used:

Northern Ireland: 21% (2007)
US: 65%


So what is your point? Also note that Ireland's really strict gun control only came about in 2004.

[Egbert]

Note that his is exactly the case in the UK. And I ask you to, again, compare the UK/US statistics and tell me they are not night and day.

Gun control laws are not the only imaginable variable. There are other possible explanations of the increased propensity of Americans to murder one another.

[Egbert]

It's a completely valid comparison.

Replace kiddy porn with nuclear bombs and it's the same. Your argument is absurd.

I agree with banning kiddy porn. OTH I wouldn't mind having a few nuclear ICBM's for self defence and maybe a few more for a nice collection.

[Asher]

Gun control laws are not the only imaginable variable. There are other possible explanations of the increased propensity of Americans to murder one another.

But I'm not just using that statistic. % of homicides using guns, % of robberies using guns, % of attempted murders using guns, % of suicides using guns...across the board these are MANY TIMES HIGHER in the US.

You can't wave your hands and pretend like Americans' murderous tendencies is the explanation. The simple fact is Americans have easy access to guns, and crimes of opportunity comprise most of the crimes out there. If you have a gun in your house and you go into a fit of rage, you're more likely to use a gun to commit your act than someone without a gun in their house...wouldn't you say?

While a redneck in Alabama will take his rifle or handgun to shoot his wife, a chav in the UK resorts to a kitchen knife. Which is more lethal?

[Asher]

Suicides in the US are also far more successful than in any other developed nation. And it's not because they're more determined. Americans use guns to kill themselves with great regularity, while in other countries it's drug overdoses, attempted hangings, etc which have far lower "success" rates.

Again, because guns are laying around the house and they're there.

[Egbert]

While a redneck in Alabama will take his rifle or handgun to shoot his wife, a chav in the UK resorts to a kitchen knife. Which is more lethal?

Getting killed with a rifle is lethal as getting killed with a knife, dead either way.

BTW You don't have to be a redneck to shoot somebody in Alabama and rednecks aren't obliged to shoot their wives.

[Egbert]

Suicides in the US are also far more successful than in any other developed nation. And it's not because they're more determined. Americans use guns to kill themselves with great regularity, while in other countries it's drug overdoses, attempted hangings, etc which have far lower "success" rates.

Again, because guns are laying around the house and they're there.

What's the point of committing suicide if don't die. That's the whole point of the exercise. That's almost an argument in favour of guns.

[Asher]

Getting killed with a rifle is lethal as getting killed with a knife, dead either way.

The point is the getting killed part is statistically far less likely with a kitchen knife vs a gun.

[notyoueither]

Getting killed with a rifle is lethal as getting killed with a knife, dead either way.

BTW You don't have to be a redneck to shoot somebody in Alabama and rednecks aren't obliged to shoot their wives.

I know this is Poly, but I think you are being a bit obtuse.

[Egbert]

I know this is Poly, but I think you are being a bit obtuse.

True, but I was arguing with Asher.

Got carried away.