Let's talk stupidity: Canadians up in arms because NHL team gets H1N1 vaccinated

[notyoueither]

The Oilers asked. They were told no.

I am relying on what my cats tell me until I figure out who else I can trust amid the gathering hordes of H1N1 zombies.

[Asher]

I've not seen a single thing saying the Oilers asked for the H1N1 vaccine and were denied.

[notyoueither]

A lot is on broadcast news or radio. I am certain Quinn mentioned it when asked in a media scrum earlier this week.

On the subject of the Flames' farm team, Eb says Justine Hunter has a very nice persian and so is a source who can be relied on. It doesn't sound as bad as when I first read about it, but who really knows with hordes of H1N1 zombies roaming the land, and the nation's news rooms...

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/life/health/h1n1-swine-flu/doctor-defends-vaccination-of-hockey-players/article1351585/

Doctor defends vaccination of hockey players
Province's top health official says physician will be spoken to but will face no punishment for giving Abbotsford Heat access to shot

...

The AHL farm team for the Calgary Flames had returned from a road trip with five members showing flu-like symptoms, Dr. Adriaan Windt said in an interview earlier in the day. He decided the rest of the team were “at high risk of getting the disease,” so he instructed them to go to the physicians' clinic where he practices to get the vaccine.

...

[Asher]

Sounds like the folks in Edmonton just have some tinted glasses, is all.

All of the comments I've seen from the Oilers organization is that their players have not been vaccinated and they'll "wait their turn", but not that Alberta Health declined a request of theirs for vaccine access. All indications are no such request was made.

[notyoueither]

Sounds like the folks in Edmonton just have some tinted glasses, is all.

Last I heard, Victoria is not a subdivision of Edmonton.

All of the comments I've seen from the Oilers organization is that their players have not been vaccinated and they'll "wait their turn", but not that Alberta Health declined a request of theirs for vaccine access. All indications are no such request was made.

That's ridiculous. The team is riddled with flu. You don't think management would have tried to do something about it?

At any rate, here is a mention of it.

http://www.canada.com/health/Flames+ignite+vaccine+furor/2180700/story.html

The Journal contacted the Oilers on Tuesday and was told that the players have not had H1N1 vaccinations.

“At this point our medical team is in contact with Alberta Health with regards to if and when we can get possible shots,” said team spokesman J.J. Hebert.

When asked if the Oilers would be jumping any lines. Hebert responded, “no, no."

[Asher]

That doesn't say anything, anywhere about the Oilers requesting and being denied the week the Flames got theirs.

[notyoueither]

That was on Tuesday. There were not many prior bussiness days for the team to be talking to Alberta health about the issue. The clinics were shut down Friday.

It was about Tuesday or Wednesday that Quinn said during a scrum that they had asked and been told no.

What is clear is that the Oilers have been talking to Alberta health and have been getting the answers the Flames should have received.

[notyoueither]

What remains unlcear is if the Flames did anything seriously wrong, or if it was just a complete doofus at Alberta Health.

The shots for the team in BC do not look good on this front.

[Asher]

That was on Tuesday. There were not many prior bussiness days for the team to be talking to Alberta health about the issue. The clinics were shut down Friday.

It was about Tuesday or Wednesday that Quinn said during a scrum that they had asked and been told no.

What is clear is that the Oilers have been talking to Alberta health and have been getting the answers the Flames should have received.

Tuesday is a radically different time than last Friday.

Last Friday morning, there was no shortage known and the Premier was telling everyone to go ahead and get their shots.

It all changed friday afternoon, so the comparison is disingenuous at best. Of course all of the teams are being told "no" now after that ****storm, are you kidding me?

[Asher]

What remains unlcear is if the Flames did anything seriously wrong, or if it was just a complete doofus at Alberta Health.

The shots for the team in BC do not look good on this front.

There's nothing unclear about it.

Ironically, the team wanted to prevent a public relations disaster by just showing up at some clinic and causing fandemonium, so they called Alberta Health officials to give them a heads-up.

The Flames organization asked if they could bring security to help control the predictable and inevitable chaos that would ensue when word got out that Flames players were standing in a lineup for four hours. Every media organization in town would have shown up along with every kid in a 20-mile radius, and parents in line with hockey-mad kids would have grumbled bitterly as their already hard-to-control kids scampered off to hover around their hockey heroes.

The Flames made those initial calls last Monday (Oct. 26). On Wednesday, an Alberta Health Services employee called and informed the Flames that, to avoid chaos, a special clinic would be held on Friday for the team.

As for the AHL farm team, it's clear that the doctor independently declared the team was high-risk for infection given that four of them were already infected by it and took them to his private clinic, which -- within the rules -- ordered its own supply to administer within the guidelines set in BC.

The Flames have demonstrably done nothing wrong here. They got their shots in a clinic Alberta Health suggested, in a clinic Alberta Health set up, at a time that the province was telling everyone there's vaccine for everyone and everyone should go get their shots, and pointedly made a point it's not just for high-risk people.

[notyoueither]

Tuesday is a radically different time than last Friday.

Last Friday morning, there was no shortage known and the Premier was telling everyone to go ahead and get their shots.

It all changed friday afternoon, so the comparison is disingenuous at best. Of course all of the teams are being told "no" now after that ****storm, are you kidding me?

Last Friday AM, most of the clinics were closing. The shortage was well known by people working with Alberta Health. The Flames, staff, and families still got their shots. 150 of them.

http://www.canada.com/life/H1N1+vaccine+shortage+feared+people+turned+away+clinics/2161628/story.html

All Calgary H1N1 vaccine clinics closed: Liepert

H1N1 hospitalizes 95 Calgarians

By Meagan Fitzpatrick, Sarah McGinnis and Chuck Chiang, Calgary HeraldOctober 30, 2009

Were you turned away from an H1N1 vaccination clinic this morning? Contact us here!


CALGARY - All five of Calgary's H1N1 clinics are closed until Saturday morning, Alberta's Health Minister confirmed this afternoon.

Calgarians had been reporting that many who showed up this morning were turned away as residents flood various locations with the fear of a vaccine shortage rising.

Ron Liepert, Alberta's health minister, told the Herald that all five vaccination locations in Calgary have been closed to further traffic, and shots will resume Saturday at 8:30 a.m. The closure is due to high traffic volumes, and officials are asking those who aren't in the higher-risk group to refrain from going to the clinic until further notice.

...

[notyoueither]

There's nothing unclear about it.


As for the AHL farm team, it's clear that the doctor independently declared the team was high-risk for infection given that four of them were already infected by it and took them to his private clinic, which -- within the rules -- ordered its own supply to administer within the guidelines set in BC.

The Flames have demonstrably done nothing wrong here. They got their shots in a clinic Alberta Health suggested, in a clinic Alberta Health set up, at a time that the province was telling everyone there's vaccine for everyone and everyone should go get their shots, and pointedly made a point it's not just for high-risk people.

I'll wait to form my opinion on that until the BS stops flying, from all sides.

The doctor in BC knew what high risk meant. It did not mean high risk of getting it. It meant high risk of dying from it. I can't take what he says at face value, just as I can't take what the province or anyone else is saying about the Flames' shots at face value.

What I know is that both the Flames and their farm team got shots. In BC the doctor went explicitly against guidelines of who should get shots.

I do not know for certain, but am of the understanding that another professional team in Alberta, the Oilers, have been unable to get shots.

I know it does not look good for the Flames.

[Asher]

Last Friday AM, most of the clinics were closing. The shortage was well known by people working with Alberta Health. The Flames, staff, and families still got their shots. 150 of them.

http://www.canada.com/life/H1N1+vaccine+shortage+feared+people+turned+away+clinics/2161628/story.html

All Calgary H1N1 vaccine clinics closed: Liepert

H1N1 hospitalizes 95 Calgarians

By Meagan Fitzpatrick, Sarah McGinnis and Chuck Chiang, Calgary HeraldOctober 30, 2009

Were you turned away from an H1N1 vaccination clinic this morning? Contact us here!


CALGARY - All five of Calgary's H1N1 clinics are closed until Saturday morning, Alberta's Health Minister confirmed this afternoon.

Calgarians had been reporting that many who showed up this morning were turned away as residents flood various locations with the fear of a vaccine shortage rising.

Ron Liepert, Alberta's health minister, told the Herald that all five vaccination locations in Calgary have been closed to further traffic, and shots will resume Saturday at 8:30 a.m. The closure is due to high traffic volumes, and officials are asking those who aren't in the higher-risk group to refrain from going to the clinic until further notice.

...

The planning for the clinic was obviously not done within 10 minutes of it happening. It's quite clear from the excerpts I've posted that Alberta Health called the Flames on WEDNESDAY to set it up. The Flames got their shots FRIDAY MORNING when the clinics were still opening, but as they were finishing up the clinics started closing down.

This is all documented in reputable news papers.

[Asher]

I'll wait to form my opinion on that until the BS stops flying, from all sides.

The doctor in BC knew what high risk meant. It did not mean high risk of getting it.

If that were actually true, seniors 65+ would be categorized high risk. They're not.

I do not know for certain, but am of the understanding that another professional team in Alberta, the Oilers, have been unable to get shots.

This is because all indications are they did not talk with Alberta Health during the "free for all" week, only after there was a shortage and only after the Flames got **** for it

I know it does not look good for the Flames.

It looks just fine for the Flames to anyone with an ounce of critical thought capability.

Alberta Health called them and set it up. The Flames just wanted to arrange security and staffing for the obvious chaos that'd occur with an entire Flames team waiting in a public lineup for 8 hours or so. They called on monday and asked about this.

Wednesday, Alberta Health called and said they're just going to set up a clinic for them to avoid the chaos.

I know you choose not to believe these facts being cited in reputable newspapers and organizations, but that's your problem.

[notyoueither]

If that were actually true, seniors 65+ would be categorized high risk. They're not.

Your argument seems to be with federal and provincial authorities. Maybe you should take it up with them.

The fact is that healthy adults are not priorities, no matter their age.

This is because all indications are they did not talk with Alberta Health during the "free for all" week, only after there was a shortage and only after the Flames got **** for it

So from being totally unaware of them asking for shots, you now know when they asked for them. I don't know that, and I doubt you do either.

It looks just fine for the Flames to anyone with an ounce of critical thought capability.

Alberta Health called them and set it up. The Flames just wanted to arrange security and staffing for the obvious chaos that'd occur with an entire Flames team waiting in a public lineup for 8 hours or so. They called on monday and asked about this.

Wednesday, Alberta Health called and said they're just going to set up a clinic for them to avoid the chaos.

I know you choose not to believe these facts being cited in reputable newspapers and organizations, but that's your problem.

I am choosing not to completely believe either party in this issue, the province or the Flames. I am happy to wait for more digging and better reporting.