Do I have a chance at making it to graduate school?

[aneeshm]

GRE score: 1600

There are three choices here:

1) You are lying

No.

2) You cheated

No.

3) You spent far, far too long studying to take the GRE general test

And no.

I didn't spend much time on the GRE at all. I'll elaborate below, in response to your more specific points.

Given the verbal abilities you've displayed on Apolyton (which are excellent for a non-native speaker, don't get me wrong) you could not have walked in and gotten an 800 on the verbal section without some serious test-specific preparation. Something like 0.1% of GRE general test takers get an 800 on the verbal section. If you achieved this via (3), prepare to be disappointed; nobody in any scientific or engineering field cares how well or how badly you did in the GRE general, as long as there isn't something blatantly wrong with your scores (e.g. getting less than 800 on the math section or less than 600 on the verbal section).

That's probably because I don't use all my verbal abilities while posting on Apolyton. The vocabulary required to crack the test I already had. The only thing left was to know a bit more about the test itself. This I got from an institute which specialises in this. I enrolled myself. It was a rather relaxed three-month course. Around an hour a day, five days a week. I used to go there after my college got over. I found it refreshing, personally. For once in my life, I didn't feel utterly alone - there were others there whose English was as good as mine. I don't think you have any idea how oppressive it is to be surrounded, all day, every day, by people none of whose sentences are well-formed.

The focus was on making us familiar with the format of the test, and the types and formats of questions that come, so that on test day, no time would be wasted in trying to understand the question formats, and we could focus on the content. Frankly, I didn't even bother much with the preparatory material they provided - it was quite easy.

The most valuable things I learnt were tactics and strategy. Because of the adaptive nature of the test, it's possible to screw up a little later, but if your first fifteen questions are correct, that makes next to no difference to your score. Further, there are ways of approaching each question. Little stuff like that which, together, makes a big difference.

So no, neither (1) nor (2) nor (3) fit the bill. The fourth option is that I already knew what I had to know. Without that extra information on the format of the test, I'd probably have gotten somewhere around 1540 or so.

Lastly, I've had much more experience than any normal person at taking multiple-choice tests. That's because all the entrance examinations after school are tremendously competitive, so we have to be very, very good at MC-test techniques.

As for the rest of what you've said: you're being far too general for any of us to decipher how strong your application is. Don't BS us with **** like "Academic record: not good. Not bad, but not exactly good either". It doesn't tell us anything.

~57% aggregate over three years.

I don't know how that translates to a GPA, so I'll give a rough idea of the curve, and how marks are perceived.

40% is the failing limit.
40%-50% is the pass class. (Bad.)
50%-55% is second class. (Tolerable.)
55%-60% is the higher seconds. (Acceptable, and I guess the average.)
60%-66% is the first class. (Good.)
66%+ is the distinction category. (Stellar.)

The person scoring the highest in the entire university gets around 80%, and a top scorer for any institution on average gets 70%. (75% for easier fields of study.)

You also didn't tell us what school you went to. Was it IIT? Was it the second-tier one whose name I can't recall?

I don't know which one you're referring to, but I'm attending an institution considered second-tier.

What do your grades translate to? What percentile of your class do you think you're in?

No idea, because we don't get this type of information - neither the college nor the university it is affiliated to releases anything like this. I hope that the break-up of marks and perceptions I gave will be helpful.

As far as research is concerned, did you ever work for anybody whose name is known outside India? What did you do for him? How long did you work for him?

The person I'm working with now, for a research-type project, will almost certainly be known outside India. The work he is doing will most certainly be known outside India. If he is kind enough to recommend me, I think it will count quite a bit.

Your research is where your letters of recommendation should come from, BTW. Nobody gives a **** about a letter from a prof who taught you a class. They want letters from people you worked for.

As I said, I do not think that will be a problem. There are a number of people for whom I have, at one time or another, done some work with which they were happy, including most of the faculty members of our department. Will a recommendation from someone like, say, the head of our department, or someone equally highly ranked, count for something?

Remember that top 15 schools in the US is about 300 students. Add in some Euro schools and you realize that top 15 in US is of such quality that there are only ~400 people in your year who will be accepted to equivalent quality schools in the entire world (assuming that entering classes in your area are of similar size to entering classes in most of the sciences).

OK.

How much do the subject test scores count? If I score well in that, too, how much will it help? I know it varies by university, of course, but on average, how much?

And I'm not exactly in the pure sciences, but in engineering. Does that make much of a difference?

[MikeH]

I don't think you have any idea how oppressive it is to be surrounded, all day, every day, by people none of whose sentences are well-formed.

He's a Canadian that posts at Apolyton. You'd think he had some idea.

I guess you scored more than him.

[KrazyHorse]

The vocabulary required to crack the test I already had.

Lord. Lordy, lordy, lord.

[KrazyHorse]

I don't know which one you're referring to, but I'm attending an institution considered second-tier.

Give me the name.

Also, it's beginning to come into focus: you have average grades from a non first-tier Indian university.

No, you are not going to a top-15 US graduate school.

Sorry. I would still apply to one or two of them on the off chance that they let you in, but I would concentrate on schools in the range below top 15. Say 16-50 or so.

Also, I would suggest that you stop being dishonest with us if you want our honest assessments.

[KrazyHorse]

The person I'm working with now, for a research-type project, will almost certainly be known outside India. The work he is doing will most certainly be known outside India. If he is kind enough to recommend me, I think it will count quite a bit.

How many articles in non-Indian, top-flight journals does he have (top-flight meaning the engineering equivalent of physical review, journal of high energy physics et al)?

If he doesn't recommend you after you work for him then either you're a horribly unreliable worker or he's an *******. No kindness involved here; the letter of recommendation is presumed to be part of the deal.

[KrazyHorse]

How much do the subject test scores count? If I score well in that, too, how much will it help? I know it varies by university, of course, but on average, how much?

I've heard that it can go from 20% to 60% of the admissions value. The rest is distributed between recommendations and grades.

[aneeshm]

The vocabulary required to crack the test I already had.

Lord. Lordy, lordy, lord.

Well, had I not had it, I wouldn't have been able to get the score I did, so I presume that I did (have it).

[Japher]

Grow a pair and apply already. You may only have a 5% chance but if you don't try you'll never know. Top schools may be out of the question, but I don't see how that should stop you from getting the education you need. Best of Luck.

[DaShi]

Top schools are overrated. They only produce arrogant jerks.

[aneeshm]

I don't know which one you're referring to, but I'm attending an institution considered second-tier.

Give me the name.

The reason I didn't mention it was because I didn't think it would mean anything to you. So I thought I'd give you the grade instead.

MAEER's Maharashtra Institute of Technology, affiliated to the University of Pune. It's ranked 13th for private institutues, and is in the top 50 overall in India (IIRC). But not first-tier, no.

Also, it's beginning to come into focus: you have average grades from a non first-tier Indian university.

About right.

No, you are not going to a top-15 US graduate school.

Sorry. I would still apply to one or two of them on the off chance that they let you in, but I would concentrate on schools in the range below top 15. Say 16-50 or so.

Very well.

Two details I think need mentioning.

First, my marks for the semester just finished aren't in yet. So the average may change to 58% or even 60%+ if they're as good as I expect them to be. At the very least, it'll improve by some amount.

Secondly, the marks for the last year aren't in yet either - because I'm currently at its beginning. The university is known for being stingy with marks in the first two years, and very liberal with marks in these last two semesters. Does it make sense for me to wait a year, get the final year marks, then apply at that time with the improved average? (The year in between I can spend either working or studying.)

Will this, combined with a (I hope) good subject score give me a chance?

Also, I would suggest that you stop being dishonest with us if you want our honest assessments.

I don't think I was being dishonest. I didn't know how many details you needed. As you asked for them, I gave them.

[DaShi]

University of Poon

[KrazyHorse]

Well, had I not had it, I wouldn't have been able to get the score I did, so I presume that I did (have it).

Your missing the joke makes it that much funnier.

[KrazyHorse]

Top schools are overrated. They only produce arrogant jerks.

I'm more of a jerk than even most who go to truly top schools (we're close, but not quite).

[aneeshm]

I'm good at taking tests too. With a half hour prep I walked in and got a 2360 (760 on the verbal, obviously, and this was prior to the replacement of analytical questions with "analytical writing"). 800 on verbal is extraordinarily high, even for a native speaker. As I said, it represents something like the 99.9% level, and many/most of those who take the test are native speakers. Please recall also that this is the 99.9% level for college graduates who are considering attending graduate school (in other words, they represent something like the top 10% of the general pop. already).

Anything above 740 is 99.9%+, if I recall the current numbers correctly.

Now, could aneeshm have gotten that score? Yeah, probably. If he spent a couple of days studying word lists and got lucky regarding which words got asked, then sure. On the other hand he could also just be lying to us, or have cheated.

I did neither. Why is it so hard to believe that I have that score? My active vocabulary is smaller than my passive vocabulary. The words I use are only a subset of the words I know.

Maybe nothing except a photo of the final score-sheet will convince you of my truthfulness. So, when it comes, I'll post it.

As far as cheating is concerned - how the hell can you do that? The test centre is completely enclosed. The testing area is guarded. You aren't allowed to take anything inside - even handkerchiefs or watches, much less anything else. They have guards with metal detectors to frisk you before you go in. You have to empty and turn out your pockets before you're allowed in. They monitor each test-taker with video cameras located in such a way as to make sure that no funny business is going on. How, in all this, can a person cheat?

[Ben Kenobi]

FWIW, I had mediocre grades (though the level of the coursework I did served as a mitigating factor here). ~3.25/4.0 GPA.

That's all? Wow.

I thought I had no chance at all of grad school with a 3.1.