Legolas: the nerfing of the Fellowship

[Guynemer]

This might be the nerdiest thread I've ever read, with the added bonus of the nerdiest slut picture I've ever seen.


Kudos to all.

[Ben Kenobi]

You are forgetting there is a war going on. Yes, the fellowship is a crucial part, but there are many fronts which aren't even mentioned at all by Tolkein! The dwarves under misty mountain were under seige, as were the Elves in Lothlorien, and in Rivendell. You could not send Glorfindel away without losing Rivendell. Yes the fellowship was crucial, but so were the other rings of Power.

Same with Faramir in Minas Tirith. You sent those who were expendable, and who were not necessary for the defense of the realms. None of those in the fellowship were essential defenders, not even Aragorn.

As for why Legolas was sent over Elrond's son, one of the big themes in Tolkein is that things are not all what they seem.

[Supr49er]

Wasn't Tom Bombadil also immune to the ring?
What was he anyway?

[Elok]

Glorfindel wasn't Elrond's son. Elladan and Elrohir were (and they came south with the Grey Company to ride the Paths of the Dead with Aragorn). And I saw no record in the appendices of an attack on Rivendell. Lorien was attacked thrice and Dale/Erebor had a three-day-battle around the same time as the Pelennor. Plus there was some brawling with the wood-elves according to the Encyclopedia of Arda (my copy of LOTR is upstairs), so Elrond would have done better to send Legolas back to help his dad.

Rivendell is actually pretty sheltered from the Enemy. Troops attacking it from Mordor would have to cross Rohan and Gondor, if going from the south, or else try to sneak between Lorien, Fangorn, the Beornings and Thranduil before attacking through the Misty Mountains. Saruman could have sent some troops up, but he was busy with Rohan and the Ents. The MM were cleaned out of Orcs sixty years before the War by the Battle of the Five Armies. They'd been somewhat replenished, especially in Moria, but not enough for an attack on Rivendell.

In fact, forget Glorfindel if you want. Send any of the Eldar in the house. Rivendell can spare one elf, and any of theirs would be stronger than Legolas.

Thanks ( ) for correcting me, NGR. Before you or anyone else thinks to correct me further, I'll correct myself: I should not have referred to Legolas as an Avari, since the elves of Mirkwood are held to be of the Nandor, who set out on the great journey but got lost along the way.

EDIT: Re Bombadil, we will never know WTF he was meant to be. That's probably the single most contested question among Tolkien spazzes, er, scholars. He doesn't appear to be of any of the Children of Illuvatar, and I'm not inclined to believe the theory that he's an incarnation of Illuvatar himself (yes, that's been propounded). He could be an extremely powerful or unique Maia, but I imagine he's something entirely unique. Anyway, he wouldn't join the Fellowship so it's moot.

[Naked Gents Rut]

Bombadil is Aule.

[Elok]

NGR, your skills have declined. That's TOO obvious a troll.

[Naked Gents Rut]

Well, I have been up for like 36 hours writing a paper on U.S.-Japan military cooperation.

[SlowwHand]

If that's not pissing into the wind, I don't know what is.

[onodera]

Originally posted by Elok
Glorfindel wasn't Elrond's son. Elladan and Elrohir were (and they came south with the Grey Company to ride the Paths of the Dead with Aragorn). And I saw no record in the appendices of an attack on Rivendell. Lorien was attacked thrice and Dale/Erebor had a three-day-battle around the same time as the Pelennor. Plus there was some brawling with the wood-elves according to the Encyclopedia of Arda (my copy of LOTR is upstairs), so Elrond would have done better to send Legolas back to help his dad.

Rivendell is actually pretty sheltered from the Enemy. Troops attacking it from Mordor would have to cross Rohan and Gondor, if going from the south, or else try to sneak between Lorien, Fangorn, the Beornings and Thranduil before attacking through the Misty Mountains. Saruman could have sent some troops up, but he was busy with Rohan and the Ents. The MM were cleaned out of Orcs sixty years before the War by the Battle of the Five Armies. They'd been somewhat replenished, especially in Moria, but not enough for an attack on Rivendell.

In fact, forget Glorfindel if you want. Send any of the Eldar in the house. Rivendell can spare one elf, and any of theirs would be stronger than Legolas.

Thanks ( ) for correcting me, NGR. Before you or anyone else thinks to correct me further, I'll correct myself: I should not have referred to Legolas as an Avari, since the elves of Mirkwood are held to be of the Nandor, who set out on the great journey but got lost along the way.

EDIT: Re Bombadil, we will never know WTF he was meant to be. That's probably the single most contested question among Tolkien spazzes, er, scholars. He doesn't appear to be of any of the Children of Illuvatar, and I'm not inclined to believe the theory that he's an incarnation of Illuvatar himself (yes, that's been propounded). He could be an extremely powerful or unique Maia, but I imagine he's something entirely unique. Anyway, he wouldn't join the Fellowship so it's moot.

I'd post a coupon for getting a life for only half the price, but I don't have a picture ready.

[Elok]

My life is already better than yours by virtue of not taking place in Russia.

[Ben Kenobi]

Glorfindel wasn't Elrond's son. Elladan and Elrohir were (and they came south with the Grey Company to ride the Paths of the Dead with Aragorn). And I saw no record in the appendices of an attack on Rivendell.

No, I'm quite aware that Elrond's sons were Elladan and Elrohir. Rivendell was the true base of everything for the alliance, given that it was sheltered away from the war. That it would be threatened, would mean all else was lost. They could not leave Rivendell to the enemy. Look at the patrols they had outside the city, regardless of whether or not the fellowship was about to arrive.

Lorien was attacked thrice and Dale/Erebor had a three-day-battle around the same time as the Pelennor. Plus there was some brawling with the wood-elves according to the Encyclopedia of Arda (my copy of LOTR is upstairs), so Elrond would have done better to send Legolas back to help his dad.

Except for the fact Legolas was sent to Elrond to inform him of the goings on. The second thing is that time is of the essence. The best place to use Legolas was with the fellowship, as it had to be done now, and Legolas was there already. If he sent one of his sons and sent Legolas back, neither would be of use.

In fact, forget Glorfindel if you want. Send any of the Eldar in the house. Rivendell can spare one elf, and any of theirs would be stronger than Legolas.

Yet Legolas was there already. It was Elrond's decision, and his sight was different then ours. Much of his decision was as he said was already fortold as if it was to happen that way. Yes, it doesn't make objective sense to send Legolas, but he was sent from Mirkwood, same with Gimli.

[Elok]

Why are you dragging his sons into this? I'm talking about Glorfindel, who was right there at the council already.

[onodera]

Originally posted by Elok
My life is already better than yours by virtue of not taking place in Russia.

That's a very general assumption, pal.

[Victor Galis]

I wonder if Legolas brought some wilderness survival skills to the Fellowship that a Rivendell elf wouldn't bring.

[Elok]

Originally posted by Victor Galis
I wonder if Legolas brought some wilderness survival skills to the Fellowship that a Rivendell elf wouldn't bring.

Eh, they've got Aragorn for that.