Marriage, Gays, and Atheists

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by DRoseDARs
But what does this have to do with pounding thick, square pegs into round, tight-buttocked holes?

You forgot to mention BK's obsession with thrusting.

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by Theben
That may well be sig material, espec if one leaves out the context.

Which quote?

[Theben]

fixed. I got xposted.

[MrFun]

Wow.

You guys really laid it on BK since I was last here earlier today! Maybe you guys even went overboard (calling BK a zombie corpose who would destroy civilization)? Come on guys - he makes stupid "argumentative points," that's all.

[Ben Kenobi]

Although BK has not given a satisfactory answer as to how ten percent of population will prevent the other ninety percent of population from reproducing,

I had this thing called work.

My point is that the west is already in serious trouble, over the next ten years we are going to drop to a ratio of just about 2 workers for every retired person.

We should be doing what we can to preserve marriage, not erode things further.

Granting civil right to marry to gays and lesbians will NOT compel churches to marry gay and lesbian couples.

Already happening here in Canada. Pastors have been charged with a 'hate crime' for preaching the biblical teachings against sodomy.

I'm telling you, it's always the same pattern. First comes gay marriage, and then they start clamping down on the churches. Unlike in the US we never got a chance to vote, it was imposed on Canada as a whole.

And in case he missed this, I would ensure that whatever we teach in school to young children about gays and lesbians would be age appropriate.

How is sexuality an age-appropriate topic for kindergartners?

[Ben Kenobi]

Clearly, it's more important to him to trash our civil rights in the name of his religious freedoms.

Nobody has a right to marry. You are asking for rights to be extended, which makes about as much sense as saying I have a right to run down the street naked, and that depriving me of that 'right' is a bad thing.

Obviously, the gay people have such respect for religious freedoms that they trash Mormon churches.


You don't see me going out and burning down the local GALA north.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
Already happening here in Canada.

Please cite ONE example of a church being forced to marry a gay couple in Canada. This has NOT happened, there IS no example, and you are a LIAR with ZERO INTEGRITY.

Shame on you, Ben -- genuinely. God hates liars, and all you ever do is lie. Honestly, if there is a God, you're going to hell for constant dishonesty.

I'm telling you, it's always the same pattern. First comes gay marriage, and then they start clamping down on the churches. Unlike in the US we never got a chance to vote, it was imposed on Canada as a whole.

It was "imposed" by our constitution.

Canada's elected representatives were given a FREE VOTE on the matter and did NOT overturn the ruling.

How is sexuality an age-appropriate topic for kindergartners?

It's not sexual unless you make it so. It's no more sexual than discussing your typical nuclear family. It's two people who love eachother.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi


Nobody has a right to marry. You are asking for rights to be extended, which makes about as much sense as saying I have a right to run down the street naked, and that depriving me of that 'right' is a bad thing.

Obviously, the gay people have such respect for religious freedoms that they trash Mormon churches.


You don't see me going out and burning down the local GALA north.

You so do not want to play this game.

Christian boys have beaten to death many gay people, and many more to near-death. Obviously, the Christian people have such respect for human life that they viciously murder gay people.

Bad Ben, Bad.

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
Nobody has a right to marry.

They do in the United States. Your ignorance of what is or isn't deemed a right is amusing, but completely useless as far as an argument goes. The Supreme Court ruled long ago that marriage is a fundamental right here. See Loving v. Virginia:

Marriage is one of the "basic civil rights of man,"

Thanks for playing.

[MrFun]

It's not use Boris; I've pointed out a couple times already to BK that marriage is a civil right in United States.

Alas, to no avail.

[Ben Kenobi]

Why is it irrational given the fact that homosexuals do not care about the fabric of society?

Why are you so hungry for the affirmation in marriage? Obviously gay people care a great deal about the fabric of society which is why they are burning mormon temples.

Why should we care if homosexuals cease to exist? All we care about is ourselves, logically. What happens after we leave is inconsequential.

That, is an illogical statement. You obviously would care if someone were to kill you. If I took this at face value, I could kill you and you wouldn't mind because you don't care about what happens after you die.

Summary because you still do not comprehend: You said "if gays were truly logical..." to start your statement. I provided a truly logical argument with no morality or emotions involved, which makes most sense for the person. You don't comprehend the concept of a PURELY LOGICAL argument, which is why you're mumbling on about morality and humanity. Fail.

You still haven't grasped Kant's argument that logical actions are in and of themselves self-sustaining. Illogical actions are contrary to their own nature, which is why they lead to their own extinction.

Am I not part of society? If society did care, how come we keep polluting at the current levels (or higher)?

If you sincerely believe that humanity is a plague that ought to be wiped off the planet, then why would you mind if I killed you, since it would only be hastening the inevitable?

What does society have to do with what gay people think if they are "TRULY LOGICAL"?

1. Their actions are not logical.
2. Their actions affect others around them, as we are seeing up here in Canada. It has had a profound negative effect on our freedom of speech and religion because gay people cannot abide by dissonance to their religion of tolerance.

I'm illustrating why, using a TRULY LOGICAL argument, it makes more sense to be in a gay marriage than a straight marriage. I'm having fun with your argumentative incompetence and you still have no idea what I'm talking about.

That was an allusion to the fact that you live in the free world, and directly benefit thereof. If the free world is in trouble, then getting your rocks off is less important then making sure the ship keeps sailing.

What makes you think we have all the time in the world?

Nice for you to let it slip that you think homosexuality is great at your age.

It's not worth the penalty you pay when you are older that's for sure.

I don't what age has to do with it. I'm gay and I've got a loving long-term partner who makes me happy, why is that "horrible"?

Good question. There's a reason why you folks are more likely to die at 40.

But if you want to trade away half your life for fun now, who am I to argue otherwise?

Do you not understand financial matters at all? I guarantee you that the money made from the early investments will completely trumpet any gains made by your children, which will not be given to you anyway.

Investment is the total output. It's irrelevant whether I see a penny of it. All society cares about is the total. Given that gay marriage is very bad for society as it is the most negative outcome given all the alternatives.

That's not the point. Again, you do not comprehend the subject. The subject is what a TRULY LOGICAL gay man would think.

Ok.

To be TRULY LOGICAL, with no sense of ethics or morality or humanity, it doesn't matter what happens after we die.

So it's truly logical if I kill you and steal all your stuff?

In terms of society today, one stands more to gain from a gay marriage than a straight marriage with children.

On what basis?

You seem to think it is "logical" that one would care what happens after they die. That's not a question of logic.

I think that society has an interest far more then your own self interest. I also think that it's not in your best interest to pursue this line either, but that of course is all about risk taking.

They are ****ing not. They're a money hole and by the time they start making money, you don't get any of it.

So then the best response is not to get married at all, because then you don't have to divide up half your assets.

Kids are a MORAL and EMOTIONAL investment, not a FINANCIAL one. People who have kids expecting them to make money off of it are immensely stupid.

From the standpoint of society, children are the greatest long term benefit.

But I don't suck at philosophy, I deride the courses for being too easy because they were ridiculously easy.

Obviously you didn't take much away from the courses.

And you are an example of why. The vast majority of students are people like you, you make ridiculous assumptions then refuse to see what assumptions you make. You argue in circles and you don't even realize it.

If you only knew how much stuff I'm holding back, that you haven't even walked into yet! You've made the ridiculous assertion that morals and morality is illogical, and yet you have this strange presumption that logic in itself is good. How do you get around that one?

The simple facts are, in a TRULY LOGICAL way, gay marriage makes more sense to an individual.

If you die at 40, does your calculation make any sense?

If you're asking about from a BIOLOGICAL SURVIVAL sense, then you are correct that it is essential to keep making babies.

Thank you. Point made and that is the point I am discussing here. You cannot universalise homosexuality.

Of course, you probably don't like test tube babies. But this in itself is a ridiculous argument, do you truly believe gay marriage will stop procreation?

No, I don't believe that either, but I do believe that our freedoms and way of life are being held in the balance. I honestly don't believe you even see how chipping away at freedom of speech and religion chips away at your own fundamental rights.

[MrFun]

You are such a hypocrite to profess to speak up for freedom and fundamental rights, considering that I and others on here have pointed out to you repeatedly that marriage is a civil right and you still ignore that fact.

[Ben Kenobi]

Christian boys have beaten to death many gay people, and many more to near-death. Obviously, the Christian people have such respect for human life that they viciously murder gay people.

So that justifies thuggery on your part in response?

I think we've seen some of the curtains come off.

[Ben Kenobi]

You are such a hypocrite to profess to speak up for freedom and fundamental rights, considering that I and others on here have pointed out to you repeatedly that marriage is a civil right and you still ignore that fact.

I have no right to demand anyone marry me.

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi


So that justifies thuggery on your part in response?

I think we've seen some of the curtains come off.

The vasty majority of gays and lesbians deplore violence as a means to achive goals just as the vast majority of straight people do. Can you grasp this?