Race may account for 6 pts. in election

[MrFun]

Originally posted by rah

I could accuse blacks of being racists when they voted for Jessie Jackson because he was a tool, but not as much for voting for Obama.

So blacks are racist because they more readily identify with others of their own race?

[onodera]

Originally posted by MrFun
So blacks are racist because they more readily identify with others of their own race?

Exactly.

[chequita guevara]

That's not racism.

[rah]

Using that definition, then it's not racists for whites to more readily identify with others of their own race either.

Either they both are or neither is.

[Imran Siddiqui]

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by rah
Using that definition, then it's not racists for whites to more readily identify with others of their own race either.

Either they both are or neither is.

Neither is. That's not the definition of racism, except in a very crude, apolitical fashion.

Racism is oppression based upon race.

[Kidlicious]

Otherwise everyone would be racist. Why do teh repugs hate everyone.

[David Floyd]

Theben,

Wrong, you lose. To combat past & present discrimination.

So, then, your point is that combating discrimination with discrimination is OK?

Also, there are already plenty of laws out there against racial discrimination in the workplace. Rather than passing new, discriminatory laws, why not just enforce existing laws?

AA is code for "All-American", which means white, blond and blue-eyed. The same companies used "Bl" to mean black. These were jotted down anywhere on an app and let the reader know whether or not the applicant was white or black. No it wasn't legal. Yes this was systematic, institutionalized, and within the last 10 years. This is a result of passive racism and you can link it to the legacy of slavery.

Then we're going to go back to, enforce existing laws. As for this happening in the past 10 years, what are some of the reasons that you think it isn't nearly as prevalent now? Perhaps because the law was enforced?

Again, I've never said there is NO discrimination in this country, no racism in this country - what I've said is that there are checks and balances/laws combating racism and discrimination (that, by the way, were passed by white people), and also that racism and discrimination are far lesser problems now than there were before.

Can you point out where any black on white violence or racism was systematic and/or institutionalized? Can you?

Actually, yes.

A study published in 1993 entitled "Highlights from 20 Years of Surveying Crime Victims" found the following: Almost 1 million white Americans were murdered, robbed, assaulted, or raped by blacks in 1993, as against about 130,000 blacks who had the same crimes committed against them by whites. Thus, even though blacks only comprise about 12% of the population, they committed something like 7.5 times the number of violent crimes against whites, than vice versa.

In 2001, according to FBI statistics http://www.adl.org/Learn/hate_crimes_laws/HCSA_FBI.asp 20% of all crimes designated by hate crimes were committed by blacks, a number which is disproportionate to the black population. In 2003, FBI statistics reported that blacks committed approximately 19% of hate crimes, a statistically insignificant difference from 2001 and again, disproportionate to the black population.

2005 Department of Justice statistics http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/homicide/race.htm note the following:

Blacks comprise 6 times the number of homicide victims as whites - however, 94% of blacks are killed by blacks, as against only 86% of whites killed by whites. That seems quite disproportionate, especially when you add in the statistic that blacks were, in 2005, 7 times as likely to be homicide offenders as whites.

I could keep going, and point out that the odds of me surviving a walk alone through Harlem at 1:00am without being the victim of some kind of crime are probably pretty remote, but I'll consider my point made for the moment.

I think that having 1 out of 3 black males go to prison in their lifetimes doesn't point to "sufficient checks and balances", but your comment of institutional racism as "that's unfortunate" sums up more than anything else you've said here.

But you already pointed out that blacks are more likely to commit violent crimes, because blacks tend to be poorer, and poor people turn to violence more often. Why would it surprise you that 1 out of 3 blacks go to jail at some point in their lives? I mean, do you really think that the number 1 out of 3 only exists because of racism? Now that's naive.

Kid,

More specifically to give minorities a more fair and equal part in society. It made society more democratic.

No, the 13th, 14th, and 15th Amendments did that.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by David Floyd
No, the 13th, 14th, and 15th Amendments did that.

No white males still dominate society. They are the authorities in government, workplaces, families etc...

[David Floyd]

So? All the law promises is equality of opportunity, not equality of result.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by David Floyd
So? All the law promises is equality of opportunity, not equality of result.

And minorities would have equal opportunity if they had equal results.

[David Floyd]

That makes no sense. There is absolute legal equality of opportunity right now.

What people do with that opportunity is up to them. Yes, there are whites who discriminate against blacks, but there are also blacks who discriminate against whites. Life's tough.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by David Floyd
That makes no sense. There is absolute legal equality of opportunity right now.

I'm talking about "actual" results and "actual" opportunity.

[David Floyd]

I don't care about results. All I'm interested in is opportunity. Trying to equalize results is unfair to everyone.

As for opportunity, what actual opportunities are denied to blacks?

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by David Floyd
As for opportunity, what actual opportunities are denied to blacks?

Lot's of jobs, loans, political offices etc...