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Straight-Talk Express embraces Voodoo Economics

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  • #91
    Originally posted by Ramo
    I don't think that you're capable of arithmetic.
    Hey, hey, hey! Be nice!

    He's probably just looking at the grand total for all withholding, not just the national income tax.

    Comment


    • #92
      "Withheld" is different than "paid". Did you get a refund? Did you make so little that you got the Earned Income Tax credit?

      Do you realize that the bottom 50% of the population (income wise) had zero federal tax liability last year?

      Do you realize that the top 10% pay over 90% of the federal income tax?

      Further, Once you reach a certain level of income there is a drastic drop off in percentage of income used for consumption and therefore the rich would pay a lesser tax rate in relation to income than the poor?

      Now...don't get me wrong. In general, I am against penalizing sucess. My philosophy is that the government does not have a right to tax people's ability to survive. My theory on taxation is that the first X dollars of income is exempt from any form of tax whatsoever. Any income above that is taxed at a flat rate that is set every year at budget time to fully fund the budget. Sales tax should be abolished!

      /me steps off soap box
      "I am sick and tired of people who say that if you debate and you disagree with this administration somehow you're not patriotic. We should stand up and say we are Americans and we have a right to debate and disagree with any administration." - Hillary Clinton, 2003

      Comment


      • #93
        The poor spend virtually everything they earn, and so almost all of their income is consumed every month.
        Ok, fair enough. That's a tax of 6 percent then. Much more reasonable then a third of my income that I would never get to see.
        Scouse Git (2) La Fayette Adam Smith Solomwi and Loinburger will not be forgotten.
        "Remember the night we broke the windows in this old house? This is what I wished for..."
        2015 APOLYTON FANTASY FOOTBALL CHAMPION!

        Comment


        • #94
          Hey, hey, hey! Be nice!

          He's probably just looking at the grand total for all withholding, not just the national income tax.
          Probably. Can't be sure, though. For the record, here are Canada's federal tax rates:

          * 15% on the first $37,885 of taxable income, +
          * 22% on the next $37,884 of taxable income (on the portion of taxable income between $37,885 and $75,769), +
          * 26% on the next $47,415 of taxable income (on the portion of taxable income between $75,769 and $123,184), +
          * 29% of taxable income over $123,184.
          "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
          -Bokonon

          Comment


          • #95
            That's a tax of 6 percent then.
            Again with the arithmetic...
            "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
            -Bokonon

            Comment


            • #96
              Originally posted by Ramo


              I don't think that you're capable of arithmetic.
              He's apparently a tutor.

              /me dies
              "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
              Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

              Comment


              • #97
                "Withheld" is different than "paid". Did you get a refund? Did you make so little that you got the Earned Income Tax credit?
                I live in Canada, so it's different. Yes, I eventually got all my money back, a year later. I could really have used that money then, and it caused me all sorts of problems that a consumption tax would not have caused.

                Do you realize that the bottom 50% of the population (income wise) had zero federal tax liability last year?
                Yes, I'm well aware of that, but it doesn't take into account withholding which is a tax-free loan to the government.

                Do you realize that the top 10% pay over 90% of the federal income tax?
                Yes, I'm aware of that. Do you think it's a feature or a problem of the system?

                Further, Once you reach a certain level of income there is a drastic drop off in percentage of income used for consumption and therefore the rich would pay a lesser tax rate in relation to income than the poor?
                They would pay a lesser rate, but they would pay a greater amount in taxes. Again, if the tax burden on the poor is smaller then it would be with income tax and withholding, then how would the poor end up worse off?

                Now...don't get me wrong. In general, I am against penalizing sucess. My philosophy is that the government does not have a right to tax people's ability to survive.
                A sales tax is much, much better then income tax with substantial withholding.

                My theory on taxation is that the first X dollars of income is exempt from any form of tax whatsoever.
                That's all fine and well, but this does nothing to deal with withholding. I know you wouldn't want to live on 30 percent less when you are just barely scraping by.

                Any income above that is taxed at a flat rate that is set every year at budget time to fully fund the budget. Sales tax should be abolished!
                I don't get the opposition to a sales tax. It's a good tax. It's obtrusive. It hits you every time, every day. A good tax is one that makes you aware of how much the government takes out.
                Scouse Git (2) La Fayette Adam Smith Solomwi and Loinburger will not be forgotten.
                "Remember the night we broke the windows in this old house? This is what I wished for..."
                2015 APOLYTON FANTASY FOOTBALL CHAMPION!

                Comment


                • #98
                  Originally posted by Ramo


                  For the record, here are Canada's federal tax rates:

                  * 15% on the first $37,885 of taxable income, +
                  * 22% on the next $37,884 of taxable income (on the portion of taxable income between $37,885 and $75,769), +
                  * 26% on the next $47,415 of taxable income (on the portion of taxable income between $75,769 and $123,184), +
                  * 29% of taxable income over $123,184.
                  Wouldn't it be better if that 15% were zero and the others were 23%, 27%, and 30%? I bet that would generate as much money and give people back the ability to save something, maybe?
                  "I am sick and tired of people who say that if you debate and you disagree with this administration somehow you're not patriotic. We should stand up and say we are Americans and we have a right to debate and disagree with any administration." - Hillary Clinton, 2003

                  Comment


                  • #99
                    Probably. Can't be sure, though. For the record, here are Canada's federal tax rates:
                    Federal + Provincial comes close to 30 percent, and this was awhile ago.

                    GST is only 6 percent. I'll take sales tax please, tyvm.
                    Scouse Git (2) La Fayette Adam Smith Solomwi and Loinburger will not be forgotten.
                    "Remember the night we broke the windows in this old house? This is what I wished for..."
                    2015 APOLYTON FANTASY FOOTBALL CHAMPION!

                    Comment


                    • How on earth are you paying 33% of your income in income taxes?
                      "The French caused the war [Persian Gulf war, 1991]" - Ned
                      "you people who bash Bush have no appreciation for one of the great presidents in our history." - Ned
                      "I wish I had gay sex in the boy scouts" - Dissident

                      Comment


                      • I actually could be argued towards a flat tax which was something like that Plato.

                        0% for the first 40k
                        30% for everything afterwards

                        while I would prefer that the very well off (100k+) payed more, I actually think that a flat tax sort of thing would cause them to pay more because currently they are getting a lot off through loopholes

                        JM
                        Jon Miller-
                        I AM.CANADIAN
                        GENERATION 35: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
                          GST is only 6 percent. I'll take sales tax please, tyvm.

                          Hee hee hee. Without the monies raised by their income taxes, the Canadians will have to disband their armed forces. Then, finally, we USAians will be able to launch a successful invasion.

                          Comment


                          • For some actual calculation, including federal and provincial income taxes, this is a good site:

                            Calculate your income tax in Ontario instantly. All Canadian tax years. Easy-to-use tools


                            As an example, if Ben made $20,000, his total income tax payable would be $2,126. I guess that's about a third.
                            "The French caused the war [Persian Gulf war, 1991]" - Ned
                            "you people who bash Bush have no appreciation for one of the great presidents in our history." - Ned
                            "I wish I had gay sex in the boy scouts" - Dissident

                            Comment


                            • GST is only 6 percent. I'll take sales tax please, tyvm.
                              And if you reduce Canada's budget by an order of magnitude or two to deal with the decreased revenues, I'm sure the poor would be just fantastic.
                              "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
                              -Bokonon

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Ben Kenobi


                                Federal + Provincial comes close to 30 percent, and this was awhile ago.

                                GST is only 6 percent. I'll take sales tax please, tyvm.
                                GST is 5 percent. God ****ing damnit, Ben, GET SOMETHING RIGHT. ANYTHING.
                                "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                                Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

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