Apple tring to push Safari onto Windows users

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by -Jrabbit
Yes, I read the post. But I disagree that this case is as egregious as the Mozilla CEO claims. The fact that the distribution system is similar to what malware practitioners have used is a fair point. But the fact remains that Safari is not malware.

You still aren't reading. I didn't say that it was malware, or even imply it. I said the problem was because the update service is automatically installing unwanted software. This makes people less likely to trust updates.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Wiglaf
Regardless, bundling IE with the OS is in the same 'problem domain' because it feeds off of user ineptitude to corner the market.

This is not true, because there exists technical reasons to bundle the browser (it's used by many programs, from Google Talk to render chats to iTunes to render the music store) as well as non-technical reasons (how else can users acquire alternative browsers).

This is purely a case of TRICKING a user into trying to download it. Very different situations.

Note that I am not *****ing about Quicktime/iTunes being bundled -- it makes sense, technically and otherwise. This is a different problem completely.

Also recall when they force fed Windows Desktop Search via Windows Update, crippling computers across entire networks (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/10..._update_snafu/)

You're showing ignorance again, Wiggy.

WSUS is not Windows Update. WSUS is a corporate deployment service that not only updates software, but installs new software (by design) across an intranet's computer network (eg, corporations use it). The problem was idiot sysadmins (you know, the ones who can't spell "slightly") who didn't configure their WSUS properly and then got upset when things installed as per the directives they had set in their WSUS settings.

There is not a single user who ever had Windows Desktop Search installed as a default option from Windows Update.

And of course, there was that little thing about using Windows update to force upgrades to IE7, regardless of whether or not you were even using internet explorer.

That's odd, we still use IE6 at work? How is this possible if IE7 was force installed?

These instances are more egregious

The only thing these examples demonstrated is your egregious use of the word egregious.

[snoopy369]

Windows desktop search is evil Regardless of the circumstances of its installation, it's a buggy piece of **** that conflicts with install programs, indexes when it shouldn't be, and spends an inordinate amount of resources to do a very simple thing

[-Jrabbit]

Originally posted by Kuciwalker

Originally posted by -Jrabbit
Yes, I read the post. But I disagree that this case is as egregious as the Mozilla CEO claims. The fact that the distribution system is similar to what malware practitioners have used is a fair point. But the fact remains that Safari is not malware.

You still aren't reading. I didn't say that it was malware, or even imply it. I said the problem was because the update service is automatically installing unwanted software. This makes people less likely to trust updates.

Your condescension is appalling. Perhaps you should re-read my posts. I never accused YOU of saying it was malware.

I totally understand the issues here, Kuci. It's the Mozilla guy who did his best to equate Apple's distribution technique to malware delivery. And he has a major browser product with a market share to protect. I was simply pointing out that he is not a man without an agenda.

How many times must I repeat that I oppose what Apple did?????

Perhaps I should also point out that I'm an enthusiastic user of Firefox.

[-Jrabbit]

Here's a summary of my thoughts on this issue:

1. Apple's action was disrespectful to its user base of Windows-based iTunes users.
2. Apple's action was deceptive.
3. Apple's action was, ultimately, harmless.

This is a tempest in a teapot. Rather than "making people less likely to trust updates," if anything, it will reinforce MS users' dislike of APPLE updates.

I would think that haters like Asher and company would be chortling in triumph at this netiquette misstep rather than beating their chests in righteous indignation. After all, you're the same guys who keep reminding us that Apple's pathetic market share makes them inconsequential beyond their fanboy niche. So I have to ask: How could so weak a company have such a profound effect on the sanctity of the Holy Update Process with one check-box?

[Wiglaf]

This is not true, because there exists technical reasons to bundle the browser (it's used by many programs, from Google Talk to render chats to iTunes to render the music store) as well as non-technical reasons (how else can users acquire alternative browsers).

Could also bundle other browsers.

You're showing ignorance again, Wiggy.

Not really. It's an update service that screwed people over by installing unwanted software.

That's odd, we still use IE6 at work? How is this possible if IE7 was force installed?

I'm using your definition of 'force', i.e. not really forced but requiring user effort to avoid it.

http://www.infoworld.com/archives/emailPrint.jsp?R=printThis&A=/article/08/01/17/Microsoft-warns-businesses-of-autoupdate-to-IE7_1.html

[Asher]

Originally posted by Wiglaf
Could also bundle other browsers.

That would be a legal minefield.

Not really. It's an update service that screwed people over by installing unwanted software.

It's an update service where the list of the software that gets installed is maintained on the corporation-level, not MS.

[Asher]

Originally posted by -Jrabbit
I would think that haters like Asher and company would be chortling in triumph at this netiquette misstep rather than beating their chests in righteous indignation. After all, you're the same guys who keep reminding us that Apple's pathetic market share makes them inconsequential beyond their fanboy niche. So I have to ask: How could so weak a company have such a profound effect on the sanctity of the Holy Update Process with one check-box?

Who the hell ever said Apple was weak in terms of media??

Apple undeniably owns the digital media market right now. This is not a "weak" company with "insignificant marketshare". The marketshare of OS X is insignificant but that's completely unrelated to this topic.

[-Jrabbit]

Fair enough. But I repeat:

I would think you'd be chortling in triumph at this netiquette misstep by Apple rather than beating your chest in righteous indignation at the evil of it all.

[DaShi]

How do you make this install request stop? I get it about once a week. It's really annoying.

[Asher]

Originally posted by DaShi
How do you make this install request stop? I get it about once a week. It's really annoying.

Uninstall iTunes/Quicktime, it's what I've done on my Windows box.

All of the "insightful people" in this thread that have said you can simply ignore it and not install it didn't seem to realize that there's no "ignore this update" feature like in Windows Update, it'll keep coming up as an update every-****ing-time it checks for updates.

[Wiglaf]

You're completely wrong. There's a button within Apple Software Update under "Tools" to "Ignore selected updates."

Furthermore, my ASU does not pop up at all demanding I do anything. COULD IT BE THIS IS ALSO A SETTING? Yep, under preferences, tell it to never auto check for updates.

You're 0/2 on that post

[Wiglaf]

[Asher]

Those are rather hidden -- why is that a "Tool"?

Apple stupidity.

Unintalling iTunes.

And what good is an updater if it never checks for updates? That leaves you exposed to security vulnerabilities...

And Safari is the least secure browser out there by the way.

[Wiglaf]

Admitting you're wrong

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