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UAW Strike - the last gasp?

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  • #31
    Originally posted by Asher
    During the last contract negotiations in 2003 UAW represented 302,500 employees.. today they represent only 180,000...
    Yes, management kept designing gas-guzzling SUVs and so the public rushed to buy foreign-made hybrids. Is it any wonder the U.S. share of the market is collapsing?

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    • #32
      Management certainly deserves a lot of the blame. First, for agreeing to the absurd union deals back in the 70s. Second, for designing ****ty cars (whether or not they're good now, they WERE ****ty in the 80s).

      I'm not sure going all-in on SUVs was a really bad play, Zkrib. It was one area they could compete in, alongside trucks.

      -Arrian
      grog want tank...Grog Want Tank... GROG WANT TANK!

      The trick isn't to break some eggs to make an omelette, it's convincing the eggs to break themselves in order to aspire to omelettehood.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by Arrian

        I'm not sure going all-in on SUVs was a really bad play, Zkrib. It was one area they could compete in, alongside trucks.

        -Arrian
        We build many trucks for the US market on this side of the border (Sierra, Silverado, off the top of my head) and our production is hurting b/c of the slowdown in the US housing market (which uses these vehicles for obvious reasons).
        Last edited by Wezil; September 24, 2007, 16:20.
        "I have never killed a man, but I have read many obituaries with great pleasure." - Clarence Darrow
        "I didn't attend the funeral, but I sent a nice letter saying I approved of it." - Mark Twain

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Arrian
          I'm not sure going all-in on SUVs was a really bad play, Zkrib. It was one area they could compete in, alongside trucks.

          -Arrian
          It was a good play until the Bush Administration allowed gas prices to double.

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          • #35
            Originally posted by Wezil
            Not even the same situation.

            a) 1000km / week
            b) paid for travel (hence the lower my /km cost the better for me)
            c) 0% financing on Cav - not so on Camry (or other non-GM)
            d) different driving conditions
            e) the myriad of other issues this discussion will bring up

            Hence, my not going there. Reply if you want but I'm done with the discussion. It's too long and it's a threadjack.
            I've only got 80,000km on mine, sure. But it's mixed highway/city, Calgary weather and Toronto weather.

            And I don't drive a Camry.
            "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
            Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

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            • #36
              Originally posted by Zkribbler


              It was a good play until the Bush Administration allowed gas prices to double.
              grog want tank...Grog Want Tank... GROG WANT TANK!

              The trick isn't to break some eggs to make an omelette, it's convincing the eggs to break themselves in order to aspire to omelettehood.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by Zkribbler
                Yes, management kept designing gas-guzzling SUVs and so the public rushed to buy foreign-made hybrids. Is it any wonder the U.S. share of the market is collapsing?
                I'm sure it has NOTHING to do with the huge cost additions GM has over Toyota et al.
                "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

                Comment


                • #38
                  You mean Toyota, the Japanese company? The government there pays for the employees healthcare, which of course makes in harder for GM to compete.

                  Or Toyota in America? It's a new company, so it has almost no retirees.

                  Most of GM's "extra costs" are healthcare and pensions.
                  Last edited by Zkribbler; September 24, 2007, 17:45.

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Zkribbler
                    It was a good play until the Bush Administration allowed gas prices to double.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Zkribbler
                      You mean Toyota, the Japanese company? The government there pays for the employees healthcare, which of course makes in harder for GM to compete.

                      Or Toyota in America? It's a new company, so it has almost no retirees.

                      Most of GM's "extra costs" is healthcare and pensions.
                      Toyota in America isn't unionized.

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Zkribbler
                        You mean Toyota, the Japanese company? The government there pays for the employees healthcare, which of course makes in harder for GM to compete.

                        Or Toyota in America? It's a new company, so it has almost no retirees.

                        Most of GM's "extra costs" is healthcare and pensions.
                        I'm talking about Toyota's manufacturing in US and Canada. FAR lower costs.

                        Blame retirees all you want, but we all know there's another problem.
                        "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                        Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Like promising said retirees the moon, and then having to deliver.

                          -Arrian
                          grog want tank...Grog Want Tank... GROG WANT TANK!

                          The trick isn't to break some eggs to make an omelette, it's convincing the eggs to break themselves in order to aspire to omelettehood.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            My Dad travels a lot by car and goes mostly with GM. He once went over it with me and explained how if he was really careful, the car can actually make him money over it's lifespan. (Aside from money coming in from business of course.) Something like, between depreciation and a base travel cost, the cost of the car (and it's operation) is less than what he can deduct because of it.

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                            • #44
                              Oh you're in trouble now.
                              "I have never killed a man, but I have read many obituaries with great pleasure." - Clarence Darrow
                              "I didn't attend the funeral, but I sent a nice letter saying I approved of it." - Mark Twain

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                IRS?

                                It's to do with the tax code. At least at the time, they would allow an exemption based on miles travelled, at a fixed rate per mile. So if you could beat that fixed rate then it made you money.

                                It's probably not possible now with higher gas prices though.

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