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Was Saddam the head of a representative government after all?

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  • #76
    Originally posted by Arrian


    They've been repeatedly beaten on for one thing. For another, the Kurdish region is vaguely functional. It would be a shame if the progress they've made was destroyed.
    Your lack of egalitarianism is disturbing. Clearly it would be more fair if Iraqi Kurdistan sucked as much as the rest of the blasted place.
    Why can't you be a non-conformist just like everybody else?

    It's no good (from an evolutionary point of view) to have the physique of Tarzan if you have the sex drive of a philosopher. -- Michael Ruse
    The Nedaverse I can accept, but not the Berzaverse. There can only be so many alternate realities. -- Elok

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    • #77
      Originally posted by SlowwHand
      We didn't need to be in Iraq a second time. We should have taken out Hussein the first time. Bush ****ed up and listened to the U.N.
      How do you see things playing out if you did take Saddam out in '91?
      "The French caused the war [Persian Gulf war, 1991]" - Ned
      "you people who bash Bush have no appreciation for one of the great presidents in our history." - Ned
      "I wish I had gay sex in the boy scouts" - Dissident

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      • #78
        I think events have proven that Bush I had some understanding, Sloww, of what not accepting a cease fire would've meant. Even if you assume for a moment that the arab members of the 1991 coalition would've found deposing Saddam acceptable (no), there would've been the little detail of then having to administer Iraq, which would probably have gone much the way things have 2003-present. The country is inherently unstable.

        And Clinton didn't ignore it. He chose not to invade, but I don't think all things short of invasion = "ignoring" Iraq.

        I'm no particular fan of Bill Clinton, but I do seem to recall him ordering bombing a time or two, and of course there were the sanctions (for all the good they did - squat).

        -Arrian
        grog want tank...Grog Want Tank... GROG WANT TANK!

        The trick isn't to break some eggs to make an omelette, it's convincing the eggs to break themselves in order to aspire to omelettehood.

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        • #79
          Can people please stop saying, "Your lack of < blank > is disturbing?" It's really hard for me not to go all Star Wars on you.
          Click here if you're having trouble sleeping.
          "We confess our little faults to persuade people that we have no large ones." - François de La Rochefoucauld

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          • #80
            Originally posted by SlowwHand
            Don't get me started on Bush, Sr. That dumb bastard should have told the U.N. to stick the idea of a Cease Fire squarely up their ass. U.N. is SO much help.
            The one time Clinton got involved at all, Somalia with U.N. help, was certainly a cluster****.
            We didn't need to be in Iraq a second time. We should have taken out Hussein the first time. Bush ****ed up and listened to the U.N.
            Perhaps more relevantly, he listened to the KSA. Removing Saddam against the wishes of Riyadh would have been ... delicate.
            Why can't you be a non-conformist just like everybody else?

            It's no good (from an evolutionary point of view) to have the physique of Tarzan if you have the sex drive of a philosopher. -- Michael Ruse
            The Nedaverse I can accept, but not the Berzaverse. There can only be so many alternate realities. -- Elok

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            • #81
              He listened to lots of people. I doubt many of our western allies were up for occupying Iraq in 1991 either. So the arabs were against it, the Euros weren't interested, and the American people sure as **** weren't up for it. But yeah, Bush Sr. was such an idiot.

              -Arrian
              grog want tank...Grog Want Tank... GROG WANT TANK!

              The trick isn't to break some eggs to make an omelette, it's convincing the eggs to break themselves in order to aspire to omelettehood.

              Comment

              • #82
                Originally posted by Lorizael
                Can people please stop saying, "Your lack of < blank > is disturbing?"
                Could. Won't.
                Why can't you be a non-conformist just like everybody else?

                It's no good (from an evolutionary point of view) to have the physique of Tarzan if you have the sex drive of a philosopher. -- Michael Ruse
                The Nedaverse I can accept, but not the Berzaverse. There can only be so many alternate realities. -- Elok

                Comment

                • #83
                  We can rebuild him. The six million dollar Saddam.

                  Really, the CIA should look into this. A robot Saddam, remote controled! A shining moment for robotics as it steps into the fore. It could kill anyone it wanted to, all in the good name of despotism and we could sit back and speak in hushed voices about how we tried to save the Iraqis but they would have none of it. In the mean time the CIA could use its robot dictator to take out the trash. If it works it could spark a whole new industry as everyone would want their own Saddam to do those nasty house chores.
                  Long time member @ Apolyton
                  Civilization player since the dawn of time

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                  • #84
                    Originally posted by Lancer
                    We can rebuild him. The six million dollar Saddam.

                    Really, the CIA should look into this. A robot Saddam, remote controled! A shining moment for robotics as it steps into the fore. It could kill anyone it wanted to, all in the good name of despotism and we could sit back and speak in hushed voices about how we tried to save the Iraqis but they would have none of it. In the mean time the CIA could use its robot dictator to take out the trash. If it works it could spark a whole new industry as everyone would want their own Saddam to do those nasty house chores.
                    California has a robot Governator.
                    I drank beer. I like beer. I still like beer. ... Do you like beer Senator?
                    - Justice Brett Kavanaugh

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                    • #85
                      Aha!
                      Long time member @ Apolyton
                      Civilization player since the dawn of time

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                      • #86
                        Originally posted by SlowwHand
                        Don't get me started on Bush, Sr. That dumb bastard should have told the U.N. to stick the idea of a Cease Fire squarely up their ass. U.N. is SO much help.
                        The one time Clinton got involved at all, Somalia with U.N. help, was certainly a cluster****.
                        We didn't need to be in Iraq a second time. We should have taken out Hussein the first time. Bush ****ed up and listened to the U.N.
                        So, you want us to have begun this Iraq fiasco a dozen years before we actually did?

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                        • #87
                          We had the coalition with us then and we could have shot them if they tried to leave.
                          Long time member @ Apolyton
                          Civilization player since the dawn of time

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                          • #88
                            Originally posted by Zkribbler


                            So, you want us to have begun this Iraq fiasco a dozen years before we actually did?
                            Yes, in the most resounding way. That's exactly what I mean.
                            Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
                            "Hating America is something best left to Mobius. He is an expert Yank hater.
                            He also hates Texans and Australians, he does diversify." ~ Braindead

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                            • #89
                              Originally posted by Arrian
                              He listened to lots of people. I doubt many of our western allies were up for occupying Iraq in 1991 either. So the arabs were against it, the Euros weren't interested, and the American people sure as **** weren't up for it. But yeah, Bush Sr. was such an idiot.

                              -Arrian
                              He listened to Cheney, who said that Iraq was a quagmire.

                              But Cheney flip-flopped.
                              Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. - Ben Franklin
                              Iain Banks missed deadline due to Civ | The eyes are the groin of the head. - Dwight Schrute.
                              One more turn .... One more turn .... | WWTSD

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                              • #90
                                Originally posted by Lancer
                                We had the coalition with us then and we could have shot them if they tried to leave.
                                Funny that, considering we didn't have/would have no means of obtaining adequate fuel for mechanized forces to continue to operate for any sustained period of time without cooperation from the Saudis and UAE in particular.

                                The major portion of our heavy forces weren't aligned on road nets, so resupply (which took ~2 months to preposition) was overland for VII Corps and XVIII Airborne Corps' non-aviation assets.
                                When all else fails, blame brown people. | Hire a teen, while they still know it all. | Trump-Palin 2016. "You're fired." "I quit."

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