Is coffee-shop coffee too expensive?

[Kuciwalker]

What one person calls frivolous, another calls important.

What one person calls overpriced, another calls a bargain.

And yet these things are not absolutely subjective. Conspicuous consumption is frivolous, however happy it makes the buyer to waste a lot of money.

You think lots of bathrooms are a necessity, others do not.

Are you really serious with this point? For most people it would be a jest, but you keep repeating it, and sound so serious...

As for positive utility, again it is subjective. If someone drinking bottle water feels better, even though the water is tap water, there is still a positive utility for that person.

And the person that feels better is a tool

[Tingkai]

Originally posted by Kuciwalker


Duh. The point is that people buy it because it's labelled as premium, and are happy to delude themselves into thinking their money is well-spent.

Actually, what you said is:

Buying premium gasoline is far sillier, actually.

than buying premium coffee when in fact there is a quantifiable difference between regular and premium gas.

[Kuciwalker]

There's a quantifiable difference between premium coffee and "regular" coffee. The difference between regular and premium gas isn't meaningful if your car isn't designed to take advantage of it.

[Kuciwalker]

The people who can actually explain exactly how premium gas benefits them are usually justified in purchasing it; most of the others, though, are just people with too much money and not enough sense.

[Tingkai]

Originally posted by Kuciwalker
And yet these things are not absolutely subjective. Conspicuous consumption is frivolous, however happy it makes the buyer to waste a lot of money.

Whether something is frivolous is relative.

When I was poor, I only had money for the basics. I owned three pairs of jeans which I wore until there were holes in them. Buying a new pair before the old ones wore out would have been frivolous.

Owning a car seemed like conspicuous consumption because I could only afford the bus.

And yes, I used to judge people. Having more than one bathroom in a house seemed like the height of stupidity. But now, I figure, hey, whatever turns on. And if you don't like the bathroom analogy, look around your place and tell what you have a lot of and substitute that. Computer games? Music? Books?

Oh, and by the by, conspicuous consumption is about buying luxury goods in order to show off your wealth. Owning a $900 watch is not conspicuous consumption and drinking Starbucks coffee does not show one's wealth.

[Tingkai]

Originally posted by Kuciwalker
There's a quantifiable difference between premium coffee and "regular" coffee. The difference between regular and premium gas isn't meaningful if your car isn't designed to take advantage of it.

Okay, show me the quantifiable difference between premium and regular coffee.

As for gas, there is a difference if your car is not designed to take advantage of it because it can cause disadvantages.

Putting regular gas in a car with an engine designed for premium gas will cause engine knock and using premium gas for an engine designed for regular gas can cause problems.

The point is, use just thought it was "silly" to buy premium gas, when in fact there is a good reason for buying it.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Kuci needs to take an econ course... or someone can just show him multiple utility curves on a graph or something .

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Kuci needs to take an econ course... or someone can just show him multiple utility curves on a graph or something .

I expect Tingkai to be thick like this, but not you, Imran.

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by Tingkai
Whether something is frivolous is relative.

When I was poor, I only had money for the basics. I owned three pairs of jeans which I wore until there were holes in them. Buying a new pair before the old ones wore out would have been frivolous.

Owning a car seemed like conspicuous consumption because I could only afford the bus.

Do you know what conspicuous consumption means?

"public enjoyment of possessions that are known to be costly so that one's ability to pay for such things is flaunted" (dictionary.com)

You buy expensive watches because they demonstrate to other people you have money. People drink bottled water because it demonstrates to others (and themselves) that they have money - if they didn't, they couldn't afford it. All the positive utility of the purchase comes from the fact that it was expensive. That is frivolous, and I think people who enjoy such things are tools.

I have money (I even earn it), I spend it on luxuries, but I spend it on luxuries that provide a benefit beyond demonstrating that I can afford luxuries.

And yes, I used to judge people. Having more than one bathroom in a house seemed like the height of stupidity. But now, I figure, hey, whatever turns on.

You really are thick...

1) Multiple bathrooms provide a benefit beyond simply spending money.

2) I didn't buy them, duh.

And if you don't like the bathroom analogy, look around your place and tell what you have a lot of and substitute that. Computer games? Music? Books?

Each of those provides utility beyond that of simply having spent money to purchase it. I actually read the books, I don't just put them on display so I look well-read. I play the games and listen to the music.

Oh, and by the by, conspicuous consumption is about buying luxury goods in order to show off your wealth. Owning a $900 watch is not conspicuous consumption and drinking Starbucks coffee does not show one's wealth.

The watch certainly is. The Starbucks is more a mix of addiction, genuine quality and consumer self-delusion (it's premium, therefore it must be better - and enough better to be worth the additional price).

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by Tingkai
Okay, show me the quantifiable difference between premium and regular coffee.

Type and proportion of ingredients, type and duration of various treatments to produce the coffee.

As for gas, there is a difference if your car is not designed to take advantage of it because it can cause disadvantages.

Putting regular gas in a car with an engine designed for premium gas will cause engine knock and using premium gas for an engine designed for regular gas can cause problems.

The point is, use just thought it was "silly" to buy premium gas, when in fact there is a good reason for buying it.

Very few people have cars that benefit. Plenty of people buy it because it's premium and they deserve premium. I thought it was obvious that I was referring to that segment.

[Kuciwalker]

My dad would never spend $900 on a watch. He wouldn't spend half that on a suit and he's a lawyer (who makes far more than any poster on this board).

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by Kuciwalker
I expect Tingkai to be thick like this, but not you, Imran.

Tingkai is 100% correct on this. The only one who may be described as thick on this is you. People's utility curves are vastly different. People consider certain things to be luxuries which other consider completely frivolous. For example, consider video game consoles or gamer PCs. Plenty consider them luxuries worthy to spend money for, while there are a good number of folks who consider them absolute frivolousness and think people are throwing away that money on kids stuff.

One day you'll have to learn that other people have different opinions on the value of things.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Oh, and calling bottled water "conspicuous consumption" . NO ONE buys bottled water to show others that they have money. That's the most laughable thing I've ever heard!

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Oh, and calling bottled water "conspicuous consumption" . NO ONE buys bottled water to show others that they have money. That's the most laughable thing I've ever heard!

Random counterexample: in one the MD lottery ads on the radio last summer, they had a bunch of people talking about what they would do with a million dollars. One of the women said "I would bathe in bottled water."

And I do know people who drink only bottled water (even at home) because tapwater is "inferior", and they are without exception consumerist tools (based on their other purchases).

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Tingkai is 100% correct on this. The only one who may be described as thick on this is you. People's utility curves are vastly different. People consider certain things to be luxuries which other consider completely frivolous. For example, consider video game consoles or gamer PCs. Plenty consider them luxuries worthy to spend money for, while there are a good number of folks who consider them absolute frivolousness and think people are throwing away that money on kids stuff.

None of this speaks to my point.

One day you'll have to learn that other people have different opinions on the value of things.

It's obvious that I see that; I just consider certain opinions disgusting and stupid. Specifically, when people value something purely because it demonstrates their social status.