Toronto is ridiculously stupid

[Asher]

Originally posted by Victor Galis


Er... the original question is why make a crown corp to make something that Bombardier already makes. Your question is equally valid

Bombardier makes the cars because they bought the company.

And I've no idea why. I guess for the fat profit margins...

[The Mad Monk]

There's light rail, and then there's really light rail...

[Victor Galis]

Originally posted by Asher

Bombardier makes the cars because they bought the company.

And I've no idea why. I guess for the fat profit margins...

I think they've bought out other tram makers though.

[The Mad Monk]

Are they buying them all so they can shut them all down and make General Motors great again?

[Colonâ„¢]

I don't understand the hard-on for streetcars/trams eithers. Perhaps if it were set up as light rail, bypassing regular streets, but otherwise...?

[-Jrabbit]

I've only been to Toronto once and was sorely disappointed. But it was a convention, so I really didn't get a great feel for the place - convention center, restaurant, hotel, sleep -- repeat.

Montreal, OTOH, was a blast. Very diverse, awesome food, strong Euro influence, great club scene... one of my favorite North American cities.

[Japher]

I always think of Tonto when I see the word Toronto... and I've heard rumors that Tonto did, in deed, suck.

[Ninot]

Originally posted by -Jrabbit
Montreal, OTOH, was a blast. Very diverse, awesome food, strong Euro influence, great club scene... one of my favorite North American cities.

Hey, me too

I got the same impression from Toronto, and I spent a week there.

[Harry Tuttle]

Does Toronto still have a bunch of empty malls? Those really creep me out.

[DRoseDARs]

Over the next 15-20 years, Reno's going to be building a hybrid "light rail" system along the main N-S street. It utilizes over-sized buses running in a dedicated lane in the middle of the road, but they can be driven on any paved surface if need be just like a regular bus system. Streetcars were discussed ... and rejected. The fear was that, like rotting flesh attracts flies, streetcars would attract even more Californians to the area...

[Spiffor]

Streetcars are rapidly progressing in Europe. They make sense in certain density conditions (where subway wouldn't be reasonable, but busses are too packed).

Streetcars go a bit faster than busses, because traffic lights etc are specifically taylored for them. They can also gobble more people during rush hour.

It always takes a lot of time before a streetcar network becomes functional. Such a system is very complex, and needs a ton of trial and error. Paris' new streetcar line is expected to be fully functional in late 2007 (it started operating in late 2006).

In short: come back and whine in a year or so.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Spiffor
Streetcars are rapidly progressing in Europe. They make sense in certain density conditions (where subway wouldn't be reasonable, but busses are too packed).

Streetcars go a bit faster than busses, because traffic lights etc are specifically taylored for them.

Why can't you do this with busses? The track suddenly allows traffic lights to be tailored for them...?

They can also gobble more people during rush hour.

Wouldn't that depend on the size of the bus/streetcar? In Toronto they're identical in size.

In short: come back and whine in a year or so.

Toronto has had streetcars since the 1930s. Almost every city if phasing them out because they're needlessly expensive and complex and provide no benefits.

If you want to see a modern mass transit system without streetcars, check out Viva (which is for cities north of Toronto): http://www.vivayork.com/

They have dedicated bus lanes and the traffic lights along the roads they run on permit straight-through travel for the busses.

[Colonâ„¢]

I have absolutely no idea why Paris installed that streetcar line instead of opting for a subway. They at least could have gone for an elevated rail that wouldn't clog up the crosspoints.

[Asher]

Here's what the streetcars are like in Toronto.



They're the size of busses with the downsides of being much more expensive, unable to move around obstacles, on rail tracks which are hazards to cyclists and pedestrians, and much harder to replace.

[Ninot]

Toronto is good for a laugh