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October surprise -- Bin Laden Dead?

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  • October surprise -- Bin Laden Dead?

    Time is reporting that the Saudis have information that Bin Laden is sick and/or dead by a waterborne illness. This has a certain ring of truth, in that Afghanistan is very rugged terrain and al Qaeda must be living rough.

    Obviously, if true, this could have a big impact on the November elections, so there are bound to be questions about timing of the announcement. Has Bin Laden been dead for a while? The CIA is precluded from lying directly to American press, so perhaps the Saudis have been asked to lie to the American press about timing?

    It seems unlikely to me that the US government could keep a secret of this magnitude for more than 1 or 2 hours, but you never know. The US must have had this information, if the French do. The leak didn't come from us.

    Also, if Bin Laden is dead, how would Bush be able to announce this? Would the CIA have access to Bin Laden's grave? Could the death be known for sure?



    Is Bin Laden Dead?

    Saudi sources tell TIME that credible reports suggest the fugitive Qaeda leader has contracted a serious 'water-borne illness,' and may have already died
    By SCOTT MACLEOD/CAIRO AND TALA SKARI/PARIS

    Posted Saturday, Sep. 23, 2006

    Fugitive Al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden, believed to be on the run in rugged terrain in the Afghan-Pakistani border region since the September 11 attacks five years ago, has become seriously ill and may have already died, a Saudi source tells TIME, echoing earlier reports in the French media.

    The source, speaking on condition of anonymity, says that Saudi officials have received multiple credible reports over the last several weeks that Bin Laden has been suffering from a water-borne illness. The source believes that there is a "high probability" that Bin Laden has already died from the disease, but stressed that Saudi officials have thus far received no concrete evidence of Bin Laden's death.

    "This is not a rumor," says the source. "He is very ill. He got a water-related sickness and it could be terminal. There are a lot of serious facts about things that have actually happened. There is a lot to it. But we don't have any concrete information to say that he is dead."

    On Saturday, the French newspaper L'Est Republicain cited a report by the French intelligence service, Direction Generale des Services Exteriors (DGSE), saying that Saudi intelligence officials "seem to have become convinced that Osama bin Laden is dead." The report quoted by the newspaper said the Saudis believe bin Laden "might have succumbed to a very serious case of typhoid fever resulting in partial paralysis of his lower limbs while in Pakistan on August 23, 2006."

    The DGSE report quoted by L'Est Republicain said that its information on the Saudi findings came from a "usually reliable source," indicating that it did not necessarily come directly from Saudi intelligence officials. The DGSE report cited by the newspaper said that Bin Laden's geographic isolation made it difficult for him to receive proper medical assistance for his ailment. The report said that Saudi intelligence picked up the first news of bin Laden's alleged demise on September 4. The DGSE says that Saudi authorities are waiting to get more details, "notably the exact place of his burial, before officially announcing the news," the newspaper said, citing what it called verbatim text from the report.

    L'est Republicain, based in Metz in eastern France covering the Lorraine region, says the French secret services considered the DGSE report reliable enough to transmit it last Thursday to the highest levels of the French government, specifically to French President Jacques Chirac, Prime Minister Dominique de Villepin, Interior Minister Nicolas Sarkozy and Defense Minister Michele Alliot-Marie. Alliot-Marie has reportedly demanded an investigation into the leak of the DGSE report to L'Est Republicain.
    Last edited by DanS; September 23, 2006, 12:31.
    I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891

  • #2
    So we have the choice between believing either a French newspaper or Saudi intel. Hm, too early to tell IMO......I wonder if the AQ guys would throw out "he was a martyr" statements on the net or Arabic news channels out of themselves if he was dead, or only if they were confronted with serious news that he indeed is.
    Blah

    Comment


    • #3
      Well, the story has been confirmed by the American press through the Saudis now. The French are only involved insofar as they leaked high value intelligence, which could then be followed up by the French and then American press.

      This has some of the hallmarks of a planted story. Whenever a foreign news source quotes intelligence agencies, my bull****ometer goes off (especially the Brit papers like the FT). As stated, by law and custom, the CIA cannot directly lie to the US press. But it can lie to overseas press. And foreign intelligence services can lie to the US press, of course.

      Perhaps a half-truth has been disseminated, in order to see how AQ reacts?
      Last edited by DanS; September 23, 2006, 12:39.
      I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891

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      • #4
        Hm, from what I read here in German media the newspaper said he's definately dead, but nobody wants to confirm that. The Saudis are only going for the "he's ill" version, which also seems the position given in the article above.
        Blah

        Comment


        • #5
          I cross-edited you regarding spreading half-truths in order to "beat the bushes" wrt AQ.
          I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891

          Comment


          • #6
            The Funeral we refrained from firing at may have been Bin Ladens. random/crazy speculation.

            Comment


            • #7
              The funeral?
              I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891

              Comment


              • #8
                The WaPo is reporting August 23 as the supposed date of death.

                I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891

                Comment


                • #9
                  There was some news a while ago that US forces in Afghanitan didn't fire (via drone IIRC) on a concentration of probably taliban forces because they looked like holding a funeral ceremony. Nobody linked that to OBL though......
                  Blah

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by DanS
                    The funeral?
                    a drone spotted ~200 taliban bigwigs, was armed, but the JAGs said not to hit it.

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                    • #11
                      As I said BeBro, random/crazy speculation.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Whoha
                        As I said BeBro, random/crazy speculation.
                        Yep, no prob, I just thought I mention it
                        Blah

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                        • #13
                          Well, the date of the funeral report is very roughly correct...

                          Just because you can't hit a cemetery, doesn't mean you can't hit people coming to and from the cemetery... So something is fishy with that report.
                          I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            If he was dead and we knew about it, why not drop the bomb when it would have had the maximum political effect during the Bush/Musharraf meeting?
                            I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
                            For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by DanS
                              Well, the date of the funeral report is very roughly correct...

                              Just because you can't hit a cemetery, doesn't mean you can't hit people coming to and from the cemetery... So something is fishy with that report.
                              I don't see the problem with hitting the funeral.

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