What really are human needs?

[Darius871]

Originally posted by johncmcleod


First off, that's incredibly shallow, and second off, as most people would agree, pleasurable experiences don't give you an overall feeling of happiness and contentment. The pursuit of pleasure is a shallow one that never leaves people truly satisfied in life.

How on earth is it shallow if it is completely consensual and the two of them have a mature, fulfilling emotional relationship? From your posts here and elsewhere you seem to have some absurd hang-up with sex in general, regardless of the circumstances. Many would say it borders on pathological.

[Stuie]

Originally posted by Darius871
From your posts here and elsewhere you seem to have some absurd hang-up with sex in general, regardless of the circumstances. Many would say it borders on pathological.

I think johncmcleod is like Eric Idle's character in the nudge-nudge wink-wink sketch. Know what I mean?

[Dis]

What I am trying to get at is that I believe society has imposed a need on me. Relatively recently, after being exposed to romantic thought from peers, I started feeling like I needed to have a really close relationship with a female. However, I don't think this is a true need. I did not undergo a change and then start feeling this way, it was after I started thinking about romantic ideals. I think the other reason for feeling such a need is a lack of self-regard. I think I want a female to boost my self-esteem. And if this is the case, the female is not what I need, better self-regard is what I need. Anyway, it pisses me off, because since I started feeling like I needed such a relationship, I started feeling worse because I didn't have it.

I really sympathize with this part. I pretty much feel the same way. Maybe not exactly the same way, but I do feel society puts pressure on me to have a girlfriend. guys ask me all the time how much ***** I got since I got my new car. I'm too embarrassed to say I haven't got any, so I lie.

The real question is, do I really want a girlfriend? Or do I just want a girlfriend to say I have a girlfriend? So my friends and family will think I'm normal. Sometimes I think I'm a loner, and should accept this. And accept the fact, I'll never have a girlfriend. I simply lack the social skills necessary to get one. But some deep down part of me truelly does want to be intimate with a woman. But I feel like the rest of me is fighting against that, and I purpsosely sabatage my effortst with women. I don't know what the answer is. I fear dying alone, but is it really that bad? Many people die after their spouses anyways, so essentually they are dying alone.

As Spiffor said, there are alternatives in society today. At least things are better than they were 200 years ago when you pretty much had to get married and have a family, or people determined something was wrong with you. things are a little better now days. But people still ask if I'm married. And then ask why not when I say I've never been married. I never know how to answer that question. Then they ask if I want kids. I'm not sure how to answer that either. I've been told I shouldn't have kids.

But like I said, when I was a teenager, it never bothered me I had no girlfriend, because no one ever asked me if I had one. It was only when I was in the navy around age 20, that guys started asking me if I had a girlfriend. And I felt like a loser when I said no. And I couldn't participate in all their discussions of their girls back home.

And then I want a girlfriend just to prove to you poly posters I can get one. I know that is all the wrong reasons. . I'd really love to get married since you guys made fun of me as one of the posters least likely to announce they are getting married.

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by Dis
And then I want a girlfriend just to prove to you poly posters I can get one. I know that is all the wrong reasons. . I'd really love to get married since you guys made fun of me as one of the posters least likely to announce they are getting married.

Make sure your wife never sees that post

[Ben Kenobi]

I don't know why you think you can't get married.

You just haven't met the right person who makes you feel like you want to be with them for the rest of your life. Someone you can't live without.

[Flip McWho]

Who the **** cares if you don't get married.

If you know they're societal pressures then why can't you ignore them?

Who cares what other people think. They're just trapped in societal thinking. It's your happiness that your've gotta worry about. Only you can make you happy because only you know what makes you happy.

Pleasures lead to happiness because pleasure makes up a part of happiness. You're right that it isn't all there is to happiness though.

The way you keep mentioning a 'higher' form of happiness makes me think you want something outside of yourself to come and tell you you're a wonderful person just the way you are, or give you a sense of meaning. I.e a God like figure.

As Spiffor said, there are alternatives in society today. At least things are better than they were 200 years ago when you pretty much had to get married and have a family, or people determined something was wrong with you. things are a little better now days.

Dis, those opinions started with individual people who spread them to more and more people. Don't let the collective get you down. Remember that most of them are ignorant ****ers anyways.

Yes, different individuals may need to do different specific things, however, these different things are always the same on a higher level. And I don't think age has a lot to do with it either. I think at different ages people have different ideas of what makes them happy, affecting their happiness that way.

What do you mean by on a higher level here? I'd agree that there are some common themes that lead to happiness over humanity as a whole but the specifics is based on the needs of the person.


And that comment about age contradicts itself.

Happiness is a perception. You percieve yourself negatively in regards to society yet you can identify that what society classifies as happiness doesn't fillful what you classify as happiness.

I don't know why you think you can't get married.

What's the ratio of men to women in the world? Obviously if its biased in favour of one group then not everybody will find that person who makes you feel like they wanna be with them the rest of their life and some people are destined to be alone forever.


The main problem I see here is that both Dis and johncmcleod care too much what other people think of them.

[johncmcleod]

I wouldn't say I care too much about what other people think of me. There is a difference between what Dis and I are talking about. He wants the needs society thinks he needs fulfilled in order to look a certain way in front of others. In my case, I actually subconsciously bought into what society tells me I need. I start subconsciously thinking I need it, and it makes me feel worse when I don't have it.

Flip, I don't think you understand. Consciously, yes, I understand I don't need it. However, on a subconscious level, I still feel that I need it. I can tell. But I don't know how to get rid of that subconscious desire. How should I get rid of such subconscious desires? How do I convince my subconscious I do not need a woman close to me (or anyone for that matter)?

[Kuciwalker]

Ever thought maybe you actually do need that?

It's not that hard, anyway. Just make sure you're able to walk away and find the next if things don't work out - don't fall for her until after you have her.

[johncmcleod]

Ever thought maybe you actually do need that?

Well yeah, that was the point of the thread. I was asking if I really did need that. I don't think people do, I just think that they think they do. I think when people are loved, it temporarily makes them feel better about themselves and washes away their problems, and also temporarily gives them a sense of purpose and belonging. That is why people feel they need to be loved. And generally, more messed up people feel they need it stronger than those who are very mentally stable. But really, love isn't what they need. They need to fix these problems love seems to heal. They need to feel better about themselves, understand themselves better, fix their own problems/conflicts/desires, and find their own sense of purpose and meaning. Love just sort of covers up the problem, but doesn't solve it. And I think if people solved these things (by actually working on them), they wouldn't feel any need to be loved, and life would be less complicated and people would be happier.

[Flip McWho]

Aye maybe you do need just that then.

Why do you think you don't need it?

Just because you think it comes from soceity doesn't make it wrong.

[johncmcleod]

It's not that hard, anyway. Just make sure you're able to walk away and find the next if things don't work out - don't fall for her until after you have her

Good advice, but how can I be like that? Easier said than done.

[Flip McWho]

You're assuming those problems exist in the first place. Maybe you feel you need a woman cause your body's changed in certain ways now?

Getting a woman takes time too, don't expect immediate results.

[Flip McWho]

I think when people are loved, it temporarily makes them feel better about themselves and washes away their problems, and also temporarily gives them a sense of purpose and belonging. That is why people feel they need to be loved.

Not everybody will need to feel loved for those reasons your've given.

[Kuciwalker]

Well yeah, that was the point of the thread. I was asking if I really did need that.

Sorry, I just picked up at the end pretty much.

[Flip McWho]

Easier said than done.

And a self defeating attitude won't get you anywhere.

You appear to like overthinking things.