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BTW this will be a good thing in the long run. Once an auto company is dead it is almost impossible to start a new one (last successful auto start up in the US was 1927 with Chrysler) so it is better to give companies time to reform so as to preserve competition in the market place.
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The way to preserve competition is for GM and Ford to go bankrupt. They can then set up their businesses on a rational (i.e., more or less profitable) long-term basis.I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891Comment
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It doesn't hurt that Japan continues to have one of the most protected auto markets in the world. Even new car dealerships must be approved by the national government instead of just local officials and the Japanese still keep cars waiting at docks for up to 6 months for "safety inspections". The Japanese are masters of nontarrif trade barriers.Originally posted by DanS
The Japanese strategy works better.
You can say the Japanese make a better product and they would have won in a fair competition anyway, but, doesn't that mean the foreign automakers should still at least get a chance to sell their products in Japan at volume? Even those cars they let in the country they tightly control supply so that market share often remains below demand. Check out how BMWs and Mercedes-Benz lurury cars are almost always back ordered and have been for decades yet some how the Japanese government keeps finding excuses to keep supply low.
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So you're solution to maintaining long term competition is to... end competition? Survey says...BUZZ!!!Originally posted by DanS
The way to preserve competition is for GM and Ford to go bankrupt.
You're just going to have to suck it up for a few model years then we'll all enjoy a stronger more competitive market for the decades because their will be more cars being offered from more manufacturers.Try http://wordforge.net/index.php for discussion and debate.Comment
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Unfo4rtunately this is often true. American capitalism suffers from the dementia that if profits can be raised a bit in one quarter then it should be done even if that means a perminent long term reduction in profits. That's short sighted and it harms the nation. Of course the raiders just take their one time profit then sell the stock so their happy but the reality is this takes healthy companies and destroys their value.Originally posted by Colon
I agree, American business wouldn't know what a long-term view is if you'd hit it in the face.Try http://wordforge.net/index.php for discussion and debate.Comment
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Toyota is raising prices because they can. Like they really want to help GM and Ford.
I drank beer. I like beer. I still like beer. ... Do you like beer Senator?
- Justice Brett KavanaughComment
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I guess you didn't read the BBC article a few months back where Toyota's CEO said he was deathly afraid of protectionist action by the US and that he believed the best thing Toyota could do was raise prices in order to give GM breathing room (he didn't mention Ford).Originally posted by Kidicious
Toyota is raising prices because they can. Like they really want to help GM and Ford.
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You must not know what bankruptcy means. It doesn't often mean going out of business. It means going in a court-protected restructuring of your liabilities so that your business can become sustainable. In GM and Ford's case, this would mean that the labor contracts that force GM and Ford to pay laid-off employees 90% of their normal wage not to work would go by the wayside, for example.Originally posted by Oerdin
So you're solution to maintaining long term competition is to... end competition? Survey says...BUZZ!!!
You're just going to have to suck it up for a few model years then we'll all enjoy a stronger more competitive market for the decades because their will be more cars being offered from more manufacturers.I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891Comment
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... And then Oerdin will be here complaining about how the workers are getting a screwing.
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I've already resigned myself to getting a screwing once the GM and Ford pensions are picked up by the federal government. All US taxpayers will be taking a haircut on this.
The workers are helping to kill the company and I have no sympathy for them. If there's a screwing going down, then they need to help themselves to their share.I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891Comment
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GM has the #1, #2, #3 plants in North America in J.D. Powers Quality rankings. I'm afraid there are a lot of people out their who think like you who think they're still living in the 1970's or 1980's and who just don't know the reality of modern results. It's a pity.Originally posted by KrazyHorse
I wouldn't even buy one of their cars, let alone the whole company.
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What everybody means by crappy cars is that they're not luxurious rather than unreliable. GM and Ford build reasonably reliable cars.I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891Comment
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I know the difference between what people say and what they mean. You think they are going to say they are raising prices to make more money?Originally posted by Oerdin
I guess you didn't read the BBC article a few months back where Toyota's CEO said he was deathly afraid of protectionist action by the US and that he believed the best thing Toyota could do was raise prices in order to give GM breathing room (he didn't mention Ford).I drank beer. I like beer. I still like beer. ... Do you like beer Senator?
- Justice Brett KavanaughComment
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Originally posted by DanS
What everybody means by crappy cars is that they're not luxurious rather than unreliable. GM and Ford build reasonably reliable cars.
"The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "Comment
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Jesus H. Christ! That is some ignorant talk. There has never been a plastic piston and GM is currently pawning EVERY SINGLE FREAKING LAST ONE OF THE EUROPEAN AUTOMAKERS when it comes to quality! That'Originally posted by Lawrence of Arabia
American cars are crap. there is no 'luxery' in american cars at less then $45,000. its all plastic garbage.
even the pistons are made out of plastic.
s right there isn't a mass market automaker which does as good a job in quality that matches much less passes GM. GM also pawns the **** out of nearly all of the Japanese automakers as well when it comes to quality. Only Toyota and Honda does better so that leaves around 11 Japanese makers who are sucking GM's tail pipe.
I just find it so funny that Euro's mass market cars are such total crap that they get beaten by Koreans in quality studies yet ignorant Euros still try to bad mouth Amnerican cars. That's just stupid.
BTW if the EU wasn't a hugely protectionist POS nearly every European automaker (bare a few high end makes) would be dead by now. Europe is still the most protected big automarket on Earth (though the Japanese are sneaky qabout using nontarrif barriers).Try http://wordforge.net/index.php for discussion and debate.Comment
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