Bolivia on the verge of revolution?

[Last Conformist]

Kid:

That's not what I was implying. You jump to the conclusion that I am not making sense. I'm making perfect sense. The problem is with you. It seems that no matter who the people elect the president ignores his mandate. I call that capitalism at gun point. What is your problem with that?

It simply isn't a reply to pchang's claim they had not capitalism but kleptocracy.

[lord of the mark]

GNP per capita grew slowly in Bolivia from 1995 to 2004, not surprising looking at the global situation. I cant find handy info on growth from 1985 to 1995. (and yes, i know mean GNP per cap doesnt answer questions of distribution)

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Last Conformist
Kid:

That's not what I was implying. You jump to the conclusion that I am not making sense. I'm making perfect sense. The problem is with you. It seems that no matter who the people elect the president ignores his mandate. I call that capitalism at gun point. What is your problem with that?

It simply isn't a reply to pchang's claim they had not capitalism but kleptocracy.

pchang made a bald assertion. I could careless if he doesn't know what capitalism is and makes up words.

[Last Conformist]

So, the proper response to bald assertion is making unrelated assertions?

[GePap]

Maybe the Indian masses prefer political power to economic wealth. They have had the wealth they do have and have survived on it for millenia. But they have been denied political power for centuries now.

Indians in Bolivia are not starving. They are simply poor.

But you can be poor and happy. On the other hand, I always thought a basic American notion is that you can;t feel like others control your detiny and feel happy.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Last Conformist
So, the proper response to bald assertion is making unrelated assertions?

I've had my fill of this.

[GePap]

Also, given the past behavior of the Bolivian elite and government, to believe that significant investment in the hydrocarbon sector in Bolivia will in any visible or significant way improve the lives of the masses of Indians on the high plateau is to wuillfully ignore the country's history.

This is why its easy for the Indians to believe that if a government dominated by THEM has direct control of those resources (which foreigners will pay to get access to anyways because they are so desperate for them) then they can actually break the cycle of history.

[Dinner]

Originally posted by Last Conformist
... coca shouldn't be outlawed. They've got programmes for legal, controlled growing of the stuff in Peru - the same should be implementable in Bolivia.

The legal market (i.e. medical use) is tiny compared to the illegal market selling to drug abusers. Even if they followed your advice most of the coca producers would still have to switch to less lucrative crops and they'd still be protesting.

[Dinner]

Originally posted by Kidicious

The people are dirt poor and will stay that way as long as the rich have control of the resources. Comprende?

Social programs can help them as can good economic policies. Most of the indians never see the inside of a school much less get a quality education. Spending money on education, building roads, encouraging foreign investment in order to create jobs, and like programs are the only proven way to improve people's lives in the long run. Of course you need money to do this that's why you try to develop the gas fields and the distribution infastructure so you can export the gas and earn hard currency. Of course drilling wells, building processing plants, and constructing a gas pipeline to the coast will coast billions of dollars which the state doesn't have. The only option is to try and attract private capital which will only work if the private company is allowed to make a reasonable return on their investment. Comprende?

[Last Conformist]

I can't see why chewing coca should be forbidden in Bolivia because Americans can't handle cocaine ...

[Bosh]

A traditional crop or not it is illegal in Bolivia to grow Cocaine

No it isn't. Growing coca for domestic consumption (ie for chewing and making tea out of) is very very much legal (I lived there for three years, I should know). Its just that the amount that's grown is, at least in theory, regulared and you're not supposed to export it.

[Agathon]

Also, given the past behavior of the Bolivian elite and government, to believe that significant investment in the hydrocarbon sector in Bolivia will in any visible or significant way improve the lives of the masses of Indians on the high plateau is to wuillfully ignore the country's history.

Word.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by pchang
It wasn't. It was kleptocracism.

That is capitalism.

[Last Conformist]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara


That is capitalism.

You don't see a difference 'tween American-style capitalism and Zaire-style kleptocracy?

[Dinner]

Originally posted by Bosh

No it isn't. Growing coca for domestic consumption (ie for chewing and making tea out of) is very very much legal (I lived there for three years, I should know). Its just that the amount that's grown is, at least in theory, regulared and you're not supposed to export it.

Well, several of the links previously posted said Coca cultivation has long been outlawed but the law wasn't enforced. On of the hallmarks of the government over the last 5-10 years has been hostility towards coca production and the pushing of alternative crops.