I Sense A Problem With The Force

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui


Ehhh...

ESB > ANH > RotJ > AotC > TPM. That's the only acceptable ordering.

Fixed it for you.

And RotJ & AotC are very close.

Um, no.

ANH is only saved from AotC/TPM levels because it has that grittiness to it and it lacks cute things. But the script/acting/direction are all pretty bad. It's overall a boring movie in many regards.

RotJ has it's very stupid things, including the ewoks, but the compensation is that you get the best space battle sequence yet put to film, the Sarlaac pit battle (minus stupid Boba Fett thing), and the throne room scenes with the Emperor. Nothing on those levels exist in the "prequel" films.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov
Um, no.

ANH is only saved from AotC/TPM levels because it has that grittiness to it and it lacks cute things. But the script/acting/direction are all pretty bad. It's overall a boring movie in many regards.

RotJ has it's very stupid things, including the ewoks, but the compensation is that you get the best space battle sequence yet put to film, the Sarlaac pit battle (minus stupid Boba Fett thing), and the throne room scenes with the Emperor. Nothing on those levels exist in the "prequel" films.

Unfortunetly you are entirely wrong. ANH is a very well done movie, setting up and defining the characters. Being a self contained movie helped it greatly, especially in the story of the redemption of Han.

The story in ANH is far more riviting than RotJ which definetly suffers from Rocky II syndrome (ie, I wonder if Rocky will knock out Apollo in this movie).

Frankly I consider RotJ to be not as good as AotC every once in a while. It depends on my mood. It's good for the throne room scenes, Leia in a metal bikini, and little else.

[joncha]

Originally posted by Ted Striker
Somebody launch Wesley Crusher!!!!

[Japher]

All movies are very well done

the problem is that fans demand a certain something, and when they don't get it they ***** about it...

I have liked them all, and I am not a fan

It ain't like it's Indian Jones or somethin!

[Brent]

Yeah, Han was pretty "cool", huh? And what was great was he lived to tell the tale!

One word for Ted and Boris: Jawas. For that matter, R2. and Gonk. And ughnaughts.

Sarlacc: Beak??? Why????

A movie where the heroes ultimately lose = a bad movie. Isn't that taken for granted in entertainment?

Best member of Original Trilogy Trio: Luke.

Ranking of movie Sith: Sidious> Vader> Maul> Tyrannus.

Best SW race: Duros. Blue humanoids, look almost like Nimoudians.

Ranking of main rebel starfighters: Bwing>X>Y>A.

Best planets shown in movies: Coruscant> Tatooine> Naboo> Hoth> etc.

[Boris Godunov]

It's as if Imran has claimed 2+2=5 all over again.

Defining of characters? The characters in ANH were pastiches, about as cliched as one can get. "Redemption" of Han? What?? Oh, he didn't run off with the loot and came back to help--haven't seen that happen before in a story, nosirree!

I certainly would never ascribe "riviting"[sic] to ANH. I mean, at times the pacing is positively lethargic. And the characters are constantly doing stupid things. Here's a clue, princess: If you know they're tracking you, don't lead them back to your frickin' main base when you're not even sure you can find a weakness in the plans. Derrr.

As I said, RotJ has big flaws, but it makes up for them with fun. And some spectacular battleage. And we at least don't have to sit through the atrocious dialogue of AotC and the god awful "love" scenes featured in that movie. The bad dialogue in RotJ is mercifully short. "I'm with you, too!"

At least they've explained Luke's character flaws as a genetic predisposition for being petulant and whiney. The prequels have served to dispel any awe I ever had for Vader, since I know that at his heart he's just a crybaby brat.

[Imran Siddiqui]

A movie where the heroes ultimately lose = a bad movie.

Um.. no. Actually that usually makes a good movie. Rocky got an Oscar and the hero loses.

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by Brent
One word for Ted and Boris: Jawas. For that matter, R2. and Gonk. And ughnaughts.

Jawas, Gonk and ughnaughts are so peripheral that it's really pointless to mention them. Window dressing. Compare to Jar-Jar and the Ungans.

The Sarlaac beak wasn't in the original film. I also don't see why it had to be added--but ultimately it didn't detract, either. Had it been that way originally, nobody would be complaining about it.

A movie where the heroes ultimately lose = a bad movie. Isn't that taken for granted in entertainment?

Actually, bad movies are ones wherein there are bad scripts, acting, directing, etc. ESB, fortunately, does quite well in all those regards. Certainly better than any of the other SW films.

Besides, the heroes don't "ultimately" lose. It's pretty obvious at the end of ESB that a sequel has been set up. The "ultimate" outcome of the story is the victory at Endor.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov
It's as if Imran has claimed 2+2=5 all over again.

Defining of characters? The characters in ANH were pastiches, about as cliched as one can get. "Redemption" of Han? What?? Oh, he didn't run off with the loot and came back to help--haven't seen that happen before in a story, nosirree!

I certainly would never ascribe "riviting"[sic] to ANH. I mean, at times the pacing is positively lethargic. And the characters are constantly doing stupid things. Here's a clue, princess: If you know they're tracking you, don't lead them back to your frickin' main base when you're not even sure you can find a weakness in the plans. Derrr.

As I said, RotJ has big flaws, but it makes up for them with fun. And some spectacular battleage. And we at least don't have to sit through the atrocious dialogue of AotC and the god awful "love" scenes featured in that movie. The bad dialogue in RotJ is mercifully short. "I'm with you, too!"

At least they've explained Luke's character flaws as a genetic predisposition for being petulant and whiney. The prequels have served to dispel any awe I ever had for Vader, since I know that at his heart he's just a crybaby brat.

Why don't we put it to a vote. Your viewpoint is decidedly in the minority. Most people place ANH almost akin to ESB in quality and RotJ much lower.

Yes, the redemption of Han. Every character wasn't truely good or evil. Han was in it for himself. He left when they really needed him and returned in the end to ultimately save the whole sheband. It's cliche now, because movies have aped Star Wars in that regard. The redemption of Han is one of the major plots of the original trilogy. He does the major step at the end of ANH, but throughout the next two movies he moves from a common rogue to a hero of the galaxy.

Lucas is very big on redemption in the original trilogy. Vader/Anakin's story is entirely one on his redemption. He is redeemed from the light side (the ending isn't nearly as good if Luke just ends up killing both of them). The redemption theme is central with Vader as it is with Han.

RotJ is Star Wars' Godfather III. Doesn't live up at all to the first two. Remember, "Star Wars" (ANH) was the only one of them nominated for a Best Picture Academy Award.

Don't just take my word for it, what about movie critics?

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/star_wars/

Star Wars:
93% positive; avg rating 8.1
Cream of the Crop: 85% positive; avg rating 7.3

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/return_of_the_jedi/

Return of the Jedi:
80% positive; avg rating 6.7
Cream of the Crop: 64% positive; avg rating 5.7

---

OUCH!

[Imran Siddiqui]

Oh, for comparison:

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/empire_strikes_back/

Empire Strikes Back:
98% positive; avg rating 8.5
Cream of the Crop: 91% positive; avg rating 7.7

I will admit that Attack of the Clones was rated lower than Return of the Jedi however (65% positive, 6.5 avg rating - Cream of the Crop: 41% positive, 5.5 avg rating).

[St Leo]

The best Britney Spears albums are as follows:

Ooops! ...I did it again > ...Baby one more time > Britney (2001) > In the Zone

[Brent]

When I turned on the ANH DVD, I wondered what they did to it and why. The Tantive firefight made me queasy. but I guess the original version was partly to blame, and the DVDs weren't all bad.

Good girl likes bad boy = bad.

Anakin's childhood makes him all the more scary. By the way, what should kids act like onscreen if not like Ani or Weasley?

the Sarlacc seems to make more sense without the beak if it's supposed to swallow people.

My bad ending = bad movie commentary had nothing to do with any of SW.

[Tuberski]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui

A movie where the heroes ultimately lose = a bad movie.

Um.. no. Actually that usually makes a good movie. Rocky got an Oscar and the hero loses.

The fight is really secondary to Rocky. It didn't win the Oscar because he lost the fight.

It's a story of the underdog pure and simple.

ACK!

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by Tuberski
The fight is really secondary to Rocky. It didn't win the Oscar because he lost the fight.

It's a story of the underdog pure and simple.

ACK!

The point is that he still lost and that didn't automatically make it a bad movie as the 'equation' seems to indicate.

[Brent]

the better version of the equation is bad ending = bad movie.