What are your thoughts on the new minuteman border patrol?

[Ned]

Originally posted by MRT144
the federal government shouldnt be a nanny for 5-10 states that dont protect their border

States have no role in protecting their borders. If they did, I would agree with you.

[MRT144]

they should since i bet its the states that are burdened by and large by illegal immigration, not the nation as a whole.

[Ned]

Mrt, you are correct on the burden. But the states cannot do anything about the border situation or the burden on social services except complain. California actually sued once upon a time. They were turned down by the courts. Schwarzenegger has been lobbying for help. So far, nothing.

[MRT144]

this is why i hate the federal government. I mean im no jeffersonian by any means but really, the time has come for states to take back what is theirs, and make decisions on the local level. this is where there is the most opportunity for change, that benefits a community.

[Ned]

Well, there have been conflicts between the Feds and the states before. It resulted in our Civil War.

[MRT144]

yeah, i still say the feds were wrong to quell it. especially looking at the moralistic intentions of many a southern christian.

[Odin]

Originally posted by Ned

I have no idea what people who want to restict immigration/guest workers want to achieve.

As I said before, keeping them illegal makes sure they won't ask for higher wages out of fear of being sent back to Mexico, it's all about corporate greed.

[MRT144]

or its protectionist in that they dont want raul and manuel taking bobby and joey's job at the jack in the crack

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by MRT144
they should since i bet its the states that are burdened by and large by illegal immigration, not the nation as a whole.

It's the Federal government's job to protect the borders. The states are prohibbited from doing so.

[Odin]

Originally posted by MRT144
or its protectionist in that they dont want raul and manuel taking bobby and joey's job at the jack in the crack

Illegals usually takes jobs no-one else wants, like picking vegetables. You wouldn't do too well at a gas station if you can't speak English.

[Dinner]

Originally posted by Boshko

And the amount of money that the US is losing by being much more restrictive in handing out student visas than other English-speaking countries is insane.

I have to agree. But Asian students don't have trillions of dollars in American businesses paying politicians to change the law in their favor. Politicians are bribed (er.. I mean they get "contributions" ) by businesses to keep the flow of cheap illegal aliens flowing.

[MRT144]

Originally posted by Odin


Illegals usually takes jobs no-one else wants, like picking vegetables. You wouldn't do too well at a gas station if you can't speak English.

exactly, but the protectionist reasoning is people, americans will take those jobs. and at this point i might.

[Dinner]

Originally posted by Odin

Illegals usually takes jobs no-one else wants, like picking vegetables. You wouldn't do too well at a gas station if you can't speak English.

A few years back businesses week had a special on the effects of illegal immigration. Most of the jobs illegals now do used to be done by citizens in the recent past. Up until the early 1980's most meat packing jobs were union jobs and as such they were highly sought after. Reagan changed several pro-union laws into anti-union laws and the result was in just over a decade 80%-90% of the meat packing jobs were filled with nonunion labor much of it (many say most of it) illegal. Wages went from $15 (in 1980 dollars mind you) with benifets to $7 without benifets (2002 or 2003 dollars). The fall in wages likely wouldn't have happened unless the meat companies hadn't begun a policy of knowingly encouraging illegal workers to come fill those jobs. The bottom line is citizens would fill these jobs but they'd demand more money to do it.

Naturally, businesses want to pay as little as possible which is fine but they should be forced to obey the law with reguard to their hiring practices. Companies which break the law and are convicted of knowingly hiring illegals currently must pay a fine of $1000. They make more then that in a couple of hours by hiring illegals at depressed wages so it is cheaper to hire illegals and just pay the occational fine.

[Wycoff]

Excellent post, Oerdin.

[Odin]

Reagan killing unions: