Lost

[Drake Tungsten]

Ghost. alternate reality, whatever. Still lame.

If ghosts piss you off that much, why are you still watching? That was the second ghost of the episode and like the 6th or 7th to have appeared on the show...

[Solver]

There is a difference between ghosts of the dead appearing to some people for whatever reason, and a ghost being in charge of the group that is the show's main mystery.

[Guynemer]

Solver gets a gold star.


Although, along those lines, one could speculate that "Jacob" is an meaningful apparition to Ben/Locke/Others along the same lines as Christian to Jack, Leonard to Hurley, Ben's mother to Ben, Yemi to Eko, etc.

[Flubber]

Originally posted by Guynemer
Jacob? Weak as hell. Whatever goodwill otherwise generated by that episode was frittered away by having a freakin' ghost be in charge of the Others.
?

A great episode except for that Jacob

Originally posted by Guynemer




Who are the Others/Hostiles? Certainly not "natives," and they have some sort of off-island access to get modern weapons. Are they not "natives" at all, but rebellious former Dharmaites? How many other Dharmaites, if any, joined Ben in his betrayal?

I was thinking they are rebellious Dharmites perhaps or just otherwise were on the island. The weapons??-- could have stole them from the Dharma folks or brought them when they originally arrived-- still an open book really

[Drake Tungsten]

I think Jacob is something completely different from the other "ghosts" we've seen. Those ghosts were probably Smokey taking human form; Jacob seems like something else...

[Solver]

What Leonard? You mean Dave?

From what I understand, the most popular fan theory about those ghosts seems to be that it's old smokie materializing itself as those ghosts. Not even the Others seem to really know what smokie is anyway.

If they handle Jacob right, he/it could still turn out to be very interesting, though, I have to admit.

EDIT: Yep... x-post.

[Guynemer]

Sorry, yup, I meant Dave.

[rah]

I agree, it was a good episode except for the Jacob scene.
Locke can not die if they just signed for three more years. If ben and locke can walk again, he'll be back.

[Drake Tungsten]

The more I think about it, the more I think Ben was really lying about being able to see and speak to Jacob.

[DaShi]

Actually, I liked the Jacob scene up until flashlight part. It was amusing to think that Ben really was insane like that.

I also don't think that Locke is dead or will stay dead (however it works). He's too important to the mystery of the island to let go. However, I think that Ben had decided to off Locke after Locke beatup Mikhail. It's obvious that Ben felt intimidated by Locke because the other Others thought so highly of him. When Locke forced Ben to take him to Jacob, it was obvious that Ben's grip on them was growing more tenuous.

It's interesting that both Ben and Locke had to kill their fathers, whom they both hated. I wonder if this is some sort of rite of passage for the others.

I suspect that Smokey, the ghosts and Jacob are all the same thing.

[DaShi]

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten
The more I think about it, the more I think Ben was really lying about being able to see and speak to Jacob.

Then how would he know Jacob was there? Or even existed?

[Drake Tungsten]

He could probably speak to him at one point, but lost the ability (much like his loss of the Island's healing power). The Others seem to think Locke is special (possibly their new leader?) and Ben has been trying to embarass him in order to hold onto his position. Maybe Ben took him to Jacob to prove that Locke couldn't see him? That would explain why he got angry and shot Locke once he figured out Locke had actually heard Jacob say something.

Then again, Ben could've always been lying about being in contact with Jacob. He could've found out about Jacob and where he was supposed to live from the Others. Pretending to be able to speak to him would've been a way to increase his status with the Others.

[asleepathewheel]

the ash has the alt-locke trapped in that cabin?

[DaShi]

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten
He could probably speak to him at one point, but lost the ability (much like his loss of the Island's healing power). The Others seem to think Locke is special (possibly their new leader?) and Ben has been trying to embarass him in order to hold onto his position. Maybe Ben took him to Jacob to prove that Locke couldn't see him? That would explain why he got angry and shot Locke once he figured out Locke had actually heard Jacob say something.

Then again, Ben could've always been lying about being in contact with Jacob. He could've found out about Jacob and where he was supposed to live from the Others. Pretending to be able to speak to him would've been a way to increase his status with the Others.

I still think that he knew that he'd have to kill Locke to remove him as a threat. Even if Locke couldn't see or hear Jacob, there's no doubting his connection with the island. It may even cause some of the Others to doubt whether Ben could see Jacob.

Also, Ben was probably curious as to what would happen if Locke were to be able to see and talk to Jacob, which is why he was so desperate to know what Jacob said to Locke. But, yes, I agree that it is possible that Ben either lost the ability to communicate with Jacob or never really had it.

[Drake Tungsten]

I also think women die in pregnancy on the Island because of Ben. Locke brought his father to the Island; Ben brought the death of his mother.