Rumsfeld is my hero too...

[CyberGnu]

Dannubis,

he is not evil...
he just doesn't understand that not everybody in the world sees the solution to problems the same way as he does...
but hey, we've had some other lovely characters in history who made the same mistake ...

I think it goes a little bit beyond that...

I agree, I don't think Rumsfeld is evil in the traditional sense, but I think he is sorely lacking in wisdom.

and the question is, what is worse: A man like Saddam, who while evil is largely powerless, or a man like Rumsfeld, who while clueless also has great power...

Or to put it another way: Is a boy pulling the wings of a fly worse than a drunk man with a flamethrower?

Edited to include Dannubis quote

[CyberGnu]

JW, what outrageus statement?

Are you actually saying that I equate Rumsfeld with Hitler? What part of "Not saying that Rumsfeld is Hitler, mind you," was it that didn't register?

Or is it outrageous to point out the huge logical flaw in the post: that these qualities are only good if they come with other qualities, such as wisdom and morals?

You tell me. What is the outrageous part?

[Lord Merciless]

CyberGnu is probably one of the people who think "that if we attack the terrorists, they will hate us more and will commit more terror acts..."

[Jaguar]

None in this thread. Your rivalry with DT goes back to before that.

[Jaguar]

Originally posted by Lord Merciless
CyberGnu is probably one of the people who think "that if we attack the terrorists, they will hate us more and will commit more terror acts..."

Another falls victim to the Cybergnu tactic.

[CyberGnu]

Rivalry? He called me an anti-semite, I asked him to substantiate, he has still not responded.

That's not rivalry. Intellectual dihonesty, if done solely to discredit israeli critism, or juvenile name-calling otherwise.

[Lord Merciless]

Originally posted by Jaguar Warrior

Another falls victim to the Cybergnu tactic.

Did I say anything outrageous?

[CyberGnu]

CyberGnu is probably one of the people who think "that if we attack the terrorists, they will hate us more and will commit more terror acts..."

There is a pretty hefty grey area, don't you think? In a place like Afganistan, where the al-quida had tacit help from the local goverment, I don't have a problem with deposing that goverment. Of course, non-violent measures should be sought first - simply present an ultimatum.

But in a case like Iraq, where there still isn;t any connection between Saddam and Al-quida, what is the motivation? Do you actually believe the US has REDUCED the threat level against the US by the actions of the last month?

[Drake Tungsten]

Your rivalry with DT goes back to before that.

I wouldn't call it a rivalry. More like an intense distaste for CyberGnu's personal politics...

[CyberGnu]

Another falls victim to the Cybergnu tactic.

And that tactic would be? To present critique far beoynd the intellectual level of the critiqued, thus forcing him to reply with a juvenile insult?

[Lord Merciless]

Originally posted by CyberGnu

But in a case like Iraq, where there still isn;t any connection between Saddam and Al-quida, what is the motivation? Do you actually believe the US has REDUCED the threat level against the US by the actions of the last month?

The Iraqi situation is too premature to conclude. We will know more in a year. The campagn has been going well so far. If the reconstruction goes well, long term threat level goes down. If not, it goes up.

As for the short term threat level, I don't think it has changed in the slightest way. Al-Qaeda are hatching their plans regardless of our actions in Iraq.

[CyberGnu]

I wouldn't call it a rivalry. More like an intense distaste for CyberGnu's personal politics...

Does it make you uncomfortable to have your views exposed as morally corrupt?

There is still a thread waiting for your response.

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=83420&pagenumber=2

[Drake Tungsten]

To present critique far beoynd the intellectual level of the critiqued, thus forcing him to reply with a juvenile insult?

Yes, because that comparison between Hitler and Rumsfeld was so dead on. I'd forgotten all about Adolf's reputation for wit...

[Jaguar]

Originally posted by CyberGnu


And that tactic would be? To present critique far beoynd the intellectual level of the critiqued, thus forcing him to reply with a juvenile insult?

Replace "critique far beyond the intellectual level of the critiqued" with "an outrageous statement most likely using the word 'reprehensible' which is my all-time favorite word" and you'd have it about right.

[CyberGnu]

The Iraqi situation is too premature to conclude. We will know more in a year. The campagn has been going well so far.

In Iraq, yes. But how about the rest of the arab world?

If the reconstruction goes well, long term threat level goes down. If not, it goes up.

In best case, the US handles the reconstruction perfectly, and you are right. But so little is required to mess it up - the minute the first american oil company sets foot in Iraq, the US has lost the war.

As for the short term threat level, I don't think it has changed in the slightest way. Al-Qaeda are hatching their plans regardless of our actions in Iraq.

And with the rest of the Arab world incensed, do you think al-Quida funding has gone up or down because of this? Several hundred arabs volunteered to defend Iraq against the US, what do you think they are doing now? Someone angry enough at the US to risk his life in the defense of Saddam, you think he will just go home and pick up his life where it started?