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Texas Executes 300th Inmate

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  • #91
    "quote:
    Let the punishment fit the crime.


    Why?"


    Outstanding rebuttal, Ramo.
    Marvelous. Fascinating. Dare I say? Even Rad.

    Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
    "Hating America is something best left to Mobius. He is an expert Yank hater.
    He also hates Texans and Australians, he does diversify." ~ Braindead

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    • #92
      It's a simple question, Sloww. Why do you advocate an eye for an eye?
      "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
      -Bokonon

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      • #93
        Yeah, Slowwhand! why?!
        urgh.NSFW

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        • #94
          Imran: that doesn't mean that we shouldn't strive for something better, or else what's the point?


          I'm not sure that there IS a point at all.

          I'm not referring to social morality. Societal morality is totally irrelevent to the issue. I'm asking you why you think retribution is moral. Not if most people think retribution is moral.


          I already told you. Just desserts. You beat up some dude, you go to jail. It's what you deserve. You shouldn't do something 'bad' and get away with it simply because it was done in the heat of passion.

          I don't believe the purpose of prison is punishment/retribution. It should exist to protect society. Societ is not protected if you go about offing people because you feel a hankering for vengeance.


          So you don't want to punish anyone for committing crimes? Wonderful . In Ramo's society the murder rate has just jumped incredibly, because the only people that will go to jail are those who have a strong likelihood of doing it again.
          “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
          - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

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          • #95
            Punishment and retribution are different things.
            urgh.NSFW

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            • #96
              Punishment and retribution are different things


              Yes, but all punishment INCLUDES some retribution in it, a feeling that the person deserves the punishment he is getting. It doesn't matter if it is deterrance or incapcitation, retribution is behind them both. Only rehabilitation doesn't include retribution.
              “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
              - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

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              • #97
                If you lock someone up for life for habitual crime, or for 3 time loser status, how does one justify anything but "eye for an eye".

                You can't, and shouldn't, set habituals back on the street.
                It's retarded thinking to do so.

                Increments of punishment finalize in execution.



                I'll advocate lopping off hands of thieves, if you'd prefer that aspect.
                Or lopping off..other, for rapists.

                The penalties must be relative to the crime.
                End of my input.
                Last edited by SlowwHand; March 23, 2003, 18:16.
                Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
                "Hating America is something best left to Mobius. He is an expert Yank hater.
                He also hates Texans and Australians, he does diversify." ~ Braindead

                Comment


                • #98
                  You stole a cookie from the cookie jar! No more fingernail on Mr Pinky!!!1!
                  Concrete, Abstract, or Squoingy?
                  "I don't believe in giving scripting languages because the only additional power they give users is the power to create bugs." - Mike Breitkreutz, Firaxis

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                  • #99
                    Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
                    Boris, that's a difference between societal morality and individual morality. Societal morality is based on laws, individual morality surely isn't.

                    Explain how it is moral to kill an innocent person in response to someone else killing an innocent person? In what society is this considered moral? Certainly not in ours!


                    It's been moral for centuries and still is in some cultures. The whole idea that since you killed my children, I will kill your children has been well established.
                    That doesn't explain anything. You say it's moral. So it's either moral by your personal morality, or by the morality of society.

                    It is clearly not the morality of the society in which you live, nor in most societies today that I can think of. Since that's the case, you must be saying it is moral by your standards.

                    So explain to me, rationally, how it is moral to murder an innocent person in retribution for the murder of another innocent. I can't believe you would seriously adhere to such a viewpoint.
                    Tutto nel mondo è burla

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                    • It is clearly not the morality of the society in which you live, nor in most societies today that I can think of.


                      You know Western society. In MANY Asian and African societies it is perfectly moral. Especially in Indian society and Mid East society. African society holds to be moral as well.
                      “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
                      - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
                        It is clearly not the morality of the society in which you live, nor in most societies today that I can think of.


                        You know Western society. In MANY Asian and African societies it is perfectly moral. Especially in Indian society and Mid East society. African society holds to be moral as well.
                        Dodging the question. You said it was moral. Your society says it isn't. So it must be moral to you personally. If so, I want a rational reason why you think it is moral.
                        Tutto nel mondo è burla

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                        • I don't personally think it is moral, but if the goal of society is equality then it is reasonable to kill your children if you kill someone else's children. You have equalized the situation.
                          “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
                          - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

                          Comment


                          • You know Western society. In MANY Asian and African societies it is perfectly moral. Especially in Indian society and Mid East society. African society holds to be moral as well.
                            Imran,

                            I think the problem here is that if you say hey it was/is moral in society x, that somebody could easily present an argument that it wasn't moral in society y. I mean under that standard human sacrifices to various gods would be moral because of a number thought it was moral. I doubt we're going to sacrifice Iraqi POWs to Huitzilopochtli (the Aztec god of war) when the war in Iraq is over, and say it's moral because the Aztecs did it.

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                            • Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
                              I don't personally think it is moral, but if the goal of society is equality then it is reasonable to kill your children if you kill someone else's children. You have equalized the situation.
                              You said, in response to UR's question if it was moral, that it was. You said it was moral even if it was illegal:

                              Let's say you kill my SO, and then I kill your SO. That's an act of retribution. Is it therefore moral?


                              Yes. It is not legal, but it is moral.
                              So explain to me how, if laws are the embodiment of a society's morality, it could possibly be moral to commit such an act, which is clearly illegal. You yourself established here that it is our society about which you are talking.
                              Tutto nel mondo è burla

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                              • korn469:

                                You've hit the nail on the problems with Cultural Relativism.


                                Imran: So if a society likes to eat babies, eating babies must be moral for that society?
                                Scouse Git (2) La Fayette Adam Smith Solomwi and Loinburger will not be forgotten.
                                "Remember the night we broke the windows in this old house? This is what I wished for..."
                                2015 APOLYTON FANTASY FOOTBALL CHAMPION!

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