The War in Iraq Thread (post here)

[Ned]

Originally posted by Willem


Bush has this distinct knack for saying the wrong thing at the wrong time. Same with Rumsfeld. If the two of them had been the least bit adroit at dealing with other nations throughout this situation, they wouldn't find themselves in nearly as big of a mess as they are now. Much of the resistance from other nations has more to do with the way they've handled things, than with the issues themselves.

To some extent, I agree with you. Bush started this with the simple statement that he had decided the Iraqi regime had to go. At that time, he hadn't presented any evidence of Saddam's continuing WoMD programs other than his expulsion of inspectors.

He should have started with a demand that the inspectors return with a toughened mandate. That would have be universally supported, I beleive. Saddam then would have pissed the world off with his defiance. France would have then been leading Europe to ask the US to lead a coalition, etc., to disarm Saddam.

Yeah, it could have been handled better.

The more Bush listens to Blair and to Powell, the more effective he is.

[NeOmega]

It's only been 12 years since the last war, we need 8 more before the war weariness wears off.....

I can just hear the Civ III pop see all those American cities billowing flames and smoke as soon as the war starts.....

[Willem]

Originally posted by Ned


To some extent, I agree with you. Bush started this with the simple statement that he had decided the Iraqi regime had to go. At that time, he hadn't presented any evidence of Saddam's continuing WoMD programs other than his expulsion of inspectors.

He should have started with a demand that the inspectors return with a toughened mandate. That would have be universally supported, I beleive. Saddam then would have pissed the world off with his defiance. France would have then been leading Europe to ask the US to lead a coalition, etc., to disarm Saddam.

Yeah, it could have been handled better.

The more Bush listens to Blair and to Powell, the more effective he is.

My point exactly. If he wouldn't have started rattling the sabres right off the bat, and instead increased the presssure over time, then the other nations would have been much more willing to go along. And he certainly hasn't helped matters any with his "you're either for us or against us" rhetoric. Essentialy there's no disagreement, Saddam must be dealt with. No one's really arguing that point. It's just a matter how.

But to give him credit, he was kind of forced into the situation. And you're right, he is getting better at it. I'm glad he's not getting all ballistic about NK. But I don't think he'll ever be a good diplomat. Both he and Rumsfeld should just shut up and let Powell do the talking.

[sabrewolf]

Originally posted by Ned
Now, others here have said that these demostrations do not reflect the opinion of the average German or Frenchman. But even if that were once true, it seems that it no longer is true. It appears the average German or Frenchman has a strong dislike for the current Republican president.

What this means is that anti-Republicanism has spread beyond the far left.

oh, yes, you're right. it's waaaay beyond our far left disliking your current president. mainly due to his actions and words, but also because of the -from european view- idiotical administration:
- ashcroft seems to be a cristian fanatic who forces his people to pray with him every morning. he also is ready to give up some of the points on your bills of rights... scary to me to be honest.
- cheney brings up this energy plan which seems very very suspicious that he's just supporting the energy industy (drill up whole of alaska for oil. same in the national parks and reservoirs. build loads of nuclear power stations.). imho he'd like to claim antarctica and drill there too...
- rumsfeld is saying some things about germany and france which you just shouldn't say. only because germany doesn't support the war, you shouldn't go comparing it with lybia and cuba. we don't compare america with the taliban regime... and both use the death penalty... (someone in germany on the right wing actually recently said that they are worried that something's not right with his head )

i don't remember back so far to ike, richie and gerald. but i do remember daddy bush and RR in his 2nd legislature. both were criticised here too, but nothing like W has to hear.
maybe we've all shifted to the left, maybe you've all shifted to the right, or maybe dubya is doing something really wrong

[Chris 62]

Originally posted by Agathon
Dear Chris 62

There's always one completely humourless and lobotomized twit online at any one point in time. Right now it's you.

It's amazing, you call someone on how stupid they are, and then they say it's you.
You really are that stupid, thanks for clearing that up!

If you think I'm seriously suggesting that Bush and Blair are poofs rather than posting a rude and amusing fake photo for the delight of others, then you need your head examined.

And why would ye be posting a ude and fake picture laddy?
Metninks ye doth protest to much.

I take it you are the sort of guy for whom emoticons were invented.

?

Physilogically, all members of the speices homo-sapein have emotions, or don't ye know that laddy?

Probaly not, ye do seem to be slow on the up-take.

[Ming]

For those that were too lazy to look for it...

*bump*

And if you look, you will see that there are many other threads to choose from as well...

[Tuberski]

Originally posted by Ming
For those that were too lazy to look for it...

*bump*

And if you look, you will see that there are many other threads to choose from as well...

I started looking for AH, but then thought, "If he's too lazy to look, why should I?"

ACK!

[Alexander's Horse]

It cost 500 posts to find this crap thread.

[Tuberski]

I was trying to link it for you when Mark locked that thread in mid-post.

ACK!

[Alexander's Horse]

This is Ming's idea of lack of bias?

[Tuberski]

Actually, it shows me a lack of bias, since you are able to spam...er post in the Civ 2 MP forum without getting PCRs.

ACK!

[Lancer]

Markos must have been having a really awful day.
He needs to get some, you know, to take the edge off.

AH, I feel for ya guy. You didn't deserve that imo. Unfortunatly mo don't mean jack **** right about now. You walked right into it and wham!

I give any mod who can do it the ok to give AH 500 of my posts.

[Ming]

Yes... Horsey walked right into it. I guess Mark is as sick of the "games" as I am.

If you don't like this thread, I'm sure you can find another Iraq thread... Lord knows there were enough of them...

Now get back on topic...

[lord of the mark]

Ming:

i find catch all threads on a topic such as Iraq or the middle east inevitably become too generalized, i prefer threads that focus on a spefic sub-topic. An example would be the discussion GEpap and i had on the question of the massacres at Halabja. We actually managed to increase what we knew about halabja, without getting into oil, hegemony, Bushs dumbness, cheese eating surrender monkeys, cowboy texans, or other distractions.

I realize that the sub topic threads sometimes also degenerate, but i think the chance of having a useful discussion is higher on them (depending on how they start) than for the general threads. And when they are too narrow and no one is interested they tend to die a natural death (as witness the two threads i started on afganistan yesterday)

LOTM

[DuncanK]

It's not so cool though when you look at the first page and they are all war threads though.