IDF will occupy Gaza and uproot Hamas

[Kontiki]

I have a question to pose to all who favor Israel's tough stance:

Why doesn't Israel simply give the ultimatum "stop the terror attacks or we will come into the West Bank and Gaza and systematically slaughter every Palestinian man, woman and child"?

Obviously, there would be a huge international backlash, not to mention one within Israel itself. But seriously, if you think that the fear of reprisal is the most effective deterrant, wouldn't this be the ultimate deterrant?

[Sirotnikov]

The reduction of Israeli incursions, as the last few moths have demonstrated, have lead to a reduced frequency of Palestinian terracts. It's only logical that an even greater reduction of oppression would correspond to a comprable reduction in terracts.

LOL

It only seems we reduced incursions. We mainly decentralised them and do it in small bits.

Infact, it is exactly the result of the large incursion, in which hundreds were arrested and dozens killed, that stopped the tidal wave of terrorist attacks.

[CyberGnu]

Name one single instant when you've actually posted a real source, and I've claimed that.

No siro, the truth is that you base your position on lies, and when I call you on them you call me anti-semitic. I have no respect for you or our attempts of justifying racism.

[ranskaldan]

Originally posted by Kontiki
I have a question to pose to all who favor Israel's tough stance:

Why doesn't Israel simply give the ultimatum "stop the terror attacks or we will come into the West Bank and Gaza and systematically slaughter every Palestinian man, woman and child"?

Obviously, there would be a huge international backlash, not to mention one within Israel itself. But seriously, if you think that the fear of reprisal is the most effective deterrant, wouldn't this be the ultimate deterrant?

I would like to throw the question back at you:

Do you favor a prison system to punish murderers, rapists, robbers, arsonists, etc? Do you favor a police force with the power to root out organized crime rings?

On the other hand, do you think we should kill the families of every single convicted murderer, rapist, robber, and arsonist? Isn't that the ultimate deterrant?

[Sirotnikov]

I didn't intend to kill you. I only intended to get you to do what I want.

Then it isn't terror. It's threatening.

Terror IMO requires actual harm to be done as a threat.

Name one single instant when you've actually posted a real source, and I've claimed that.

I've posted a list of large terrorist acts from the last year, and you've said "haven't heard of them" for the most of them.

I couldn't actually bring any reliable source to prove they exist, since Israeli media are so unreliable and government controlled, and CNN often merely said "4 Israelis and 5 Palestinains died today in violence in the middle east" and do not specify how they died.

So you practically base your position on the irrelevance of sources that can give exact descriptions.

Furthermore your idiotic allegations about the Israeli media are tiresome at best.

The phallacy in treating palestinian and israeli media the same, is just like treating saddam and bush in the same manner.

I shouldn't be telling you that - since you, and many people who think like you, do exactly that.

Name a single instant when you ever posted any source what so ever.

[Sirotnikov]

Cyber - when I begin to care for the respect of the likes of you, i'll admit myself to a hospital.

You are full of hatred and prejudice and hide behind semantics, logical phallacies and lack of information. I know people like you come a dime a dozen.

Hey, if you think like a nazi and you talk like a nazi - guess what are you? Not a duck - that's for sure.

[Kontiki]

Originally posted by ranskaldan


I would like to throw the question back at you:

Do you favor a prison system to punish murderers, rapists, robbers, arsonists, etc? Do you favor a police force with the power to root out organized crime rings?

On the other hand, do you think we should kill the families of every single convicted murderer, rapist, robber, and arsonist? Isn't that the ultimate deterrant?

The answer to your first two questions is yes, I do. As for your second one, no it's not.

Having answered those questions, I'd like to ask you one:

How was that throwing the question back at me? Perhaps to be more accurate, you may have asked me if I favor a system where everyone is put under curfew with the threat of occupation should a crime be committed in a neighbourhood. How much are people going to respect the police then? Or maybe do I think the cause of all crimes is a perceived lack of punishment.

Let me be as blunt as possible. Having an automatic death penalty for all crimes are not going to stop crime ffrom happening. By the same token, using constant opression and threats in Palestine is not going to stop terrorist bombings. The point of my post is that if you think that it actually will, wouldn't the threat of mass extermination be the logical end?

[CyberGnu]

A single instant? How EVERY SINGLE INSTANT WHEN ASKED?

If I present a fact to support my point, I'm prepared to back it up.

How about the argument about viability of the palestinian state, that you so conveniantly forgot? I presented a link to 'Le Monde', a well respected french news paper.

You claimed it was run by palestinians.


That might actually have been the dumbest argument I've seen on any of the ME threads...


the 'long list' you posted consisted of 12 points. I proved half of them irrelevant, proved 3 utterly wrong, conceeded one, and was left with 2 that I asked for a source on. You couldn;t find one, so I had to conclude that you made it up, or listened to someone who made it up.

I know it is hard, siro, when other people won't accept the statements you make up. People won't believe me when I tell them I have superpowers, for example, which makes me go home and cry myself to sleep. But I'm a big boy now. I have to learn to get over it.

Bah. Either learn how to think or go join your friends in those nice brown shirts.

[Sirotnikov]

Why is CyberGnu so conserned with post-holocost sympathy for jews?

Why is CyberGnu so often likes to use nazi expressions ?

Why is CyberGnu so keen to paint Israel to be nazi?

When has CyberGnu ever brought a source?

When has CyberGnu ever justified or proved his claim about the entire Israeli media being full of 'zionist lies'?

Why is it CyberGnu keeps mentioning bribe money for politicians as Israel's (Jewish) tool?

Why is it that according to CyberGnu, it is Israel that corrupts the entire world using propoganda and bribe money?

When has he ever based that allegation?

When have we heard similar accusations before? (Simplified: Jews take over the world using media and money)

Guess what??

CyberGnu sounds, thinks and behaves like a nazi!

[CyberGnu]

Hey, if you think like a nazi and you talk like a nazi - guess what are you? Not a duck - that's for sure.

Exactly.

Question: When you are chanting your 'Heil Sharon', do you guys actually do the extended right arm as well?

Cyber - when I begin to care for the respect of the likes of you, i'll admit myself to a hospital.

Not a bad thought, that. I don't expect it to happen any time soon, though. But one day you might grow up... Who knows?

[Ned]

Have any of you actually read the British Dosssier on Iraq. It is very hard to read, especially at the end when the report begins to describe Saddam's police state, his killings and his tortures. CyberGnu, talking about Fascists. Saddam is problably the worst example of one in the world today. I think he ranks right up there with Hitler.

I have no doubt that if the world gives him even half a chance, he will conquer the entire mid-East and attempt to exterminate Israel. This man really is after the oil.

Regardless, even if Sharon is guilty as charged of war crimes, Saddam is orders of magnitude worse.

[CyberGnu]

Why am I so concerened? Because I believe in justice and civilization. You believe that jews have the right to steal land and oppress a people, because jews are stronger.

I know logical thinking isn;t your strong point, but even a pro-israeli might recognise the pattern.

[Sirotnikov]

You claimed it was run by palestinians.

quote? link?

I proved half of them irrelevant, proved 3 utterly wrong,

proved? LOL

Your "proof" was YOU saying "Well it's obvious that the terrorist merely meant to hurt everyone at that place, without special regard toward innocent people"

[CyberGnu]

Ned, I actually agree. However, the US has squandered the moral high ground to attack him by actiely supporting the nextdoor neighbour who does the same thing.

This is one of the reasons I vehemently oppose Israel - it shuts the door on other situation that needs to be taken care of.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Saddam is problably the worst example of one in the world today.

I'd say Sharon is worse than Saddam.