Man kills burglar in UK, gets life for manslaughter.

[Lincoln]

Originally posted by loinburger
Lincoln:
Just curious: did the guy actually have a gun, or was he bluffing?

I never found out and I didn't ask him. He did not display one so it he had one it was in his pocket.

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

I suppose that in America, the houseowner might not face manslaughter charges.

He'd just face a $80,000,000,000 lawsuit from the burglar's family, neighbours and pedicurist.

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

Originally posted by Lincoln


I never found out and I didn't ask him. He did not display one so it he had one it was in his pocket.

He was just pleased to see you.

[DrSpike]

Hold on Lincoln, I'm not able to reconcile your earlier opinions with what you did when faced with a burglar.

[SpencerH]

Lincoln.

I have to say that what you did seems incredibly foolish to me. My training says either retreat and call for reinforcements (ie the police) or go in and ambush the bastard. Calling out just gives away the element of surprise.

[Kaak]

that is redamdiculous.

******overview of thought process*********
What was that noise? !!! I think it is a burglar..HOLY @$%#@ What do i do?! Well, I better turn on the lights to make sure that he has something that can hurt me so i can stab him. "Excuse me Mr Burglar, I'm scared, and i want to kill you for breaking in my house, but i need to know if you have any weapons first...


What kind of freakin idiots are the british?

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

The sort of freaking idiots who, on entering our houses and suspecting that a burglar is inside, are expected to step back out of the house and phone the police rather than stabbing the burglar 12 times in the back.

[MikeH]

Because confronting them puts you in danger.

[Kaak]

lol...sure call the police. i agree with that. Someone will need to pack up/carry the body away after i am done with the sorry mother for violating my sh!t

[Akaoz]

If anyone is interested in how we do things in Norway, I’ll tell you.

We have a concept called “nødverge” (often translated to Self Defense, but it’s not quite the same thing.). This applies to all situations where you have to break the law in order to stop an “unlawful” attack on your person or someone else.

You are allowed to break the law to the same extend as the unlawful act you are trying to stop. Thus, if someone pulls a knife on you, that is considered deadly force and carries the same penalty as a gun. You may then us deadly force to protect yourself. Problem is, there are very few legal ways to carry a knife or gun in Norway, so you might face charges for carrying a weapon…

We have another concept called “nødrett” (roughly “emergency rights”. This applies to situations where you have to break the law to avoid a greater calamity. E.g. if you are caught ought in a blizzard and fear for your health/life, you are allowed to break into a cabin to seek shelter.

When it comes to things like shop-lifting, theft and burglary, “nødrett” applies. The only thing threatened is property and the use of force must be limited. In the case of petty theft <200$ it carries a maximum prison sentence of less then 6 months and you are not allowed to hold the person back until police arrives. This is because “frihetsberøvelse” (holding someone against their will) carries a 6 month sentence. However, as soon as someone commits a crime that carries a penalty greater then 6 months you are allowed to restrain that person until the police arrive.

In the case of catching a burglar in your house, you can detain him if you wish, but you are not allowed to harm him unless he tries to harm you. What level of force/threat you can use to detain him depends on the judge and jury mostly. If all he is trying to do is get away, and he isn’t holding on to your valuables, you are best advised to let him run.

This is a rough summary of Norwegian law, as civilians know it. I work for a private Security firm here in Norway, and I have worked with police and taken a number of exams/tests to be allowed to work with them. I am also a member of the Emergency Police Force, and a former military police.

Remember that in Norway the police are unarmed, and most of our criminals are to

-Alech

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

This discussion is a little premature, in any event. While the maximum penalty for manslaughter is life, it can also carry an absolute discharge. Or any sentence in between. Why not wait to see what he actually gets?

[Akaoz]

Originally posted by Felch X
People seem to act like America is savage because we kill people over property.

I think that being willing to kill to protect your TV is pretty savage and primitive, yes.

But that's not the only reason I think America is savage.

-Alech

[Tolls]

We ought to have a Poly sweepstake on it...

[Lincoln]

Originally posted by DrSpike
Hold on Lincoln, I'm not able to reconcile your earlier opinions with what you did when faced with a burglar.

I would not shoot anyone. It was just me and him. I have lived a full life already. I really don't know why I handled the situation the way that I did but it worked for his benefit. He never forgot it and I am glad that I did not handle it differently.

As far as other people acting differently I cannot expect them to be mister nice guy when they susect that their family is in danger. I loved these guys that I worked with at the prison. Many of them are my friends and I think they need to be shown something besides hate and retribution for their actions. But I cannot condemn someone who uses force. That is their decision and the law should not condemn them for making it.

[Kaak]

true. But the right to property is fundamental. I believe thatm because of greed, this man violated an absolute right, and, by doing, relinquished his right to protection under the law.

it just seems ironic that someone would be punished by the law for punishing someone who was breaking it. ( i know, i know, we had a long discussion on irony. Here it is: he was trying to protect his freedom, and property, and now he is going to jail where he will have neither.)

Thank god i live in texas.