Why you can't satisfy ANY demands by terrorists before ridding of every one of them

[Imran Siddiqui]

That's the problem. You know, if I asked this question in 1999, you would have said, we stepped over it in 1995 or something. You will never admit there is another road in the end.

[Sirotnikov]

Imran - quite the contrary - I support all possible actions.

I'm not saying "hey, let's forget the peace process and kill all palestinians and wait until the submit".

I'm saying - let's get rid of the terrorists and quickly proceed with the peace process.

[Sirotnikov]

Imran - you're wrong. At least about me.

In 1999 I was a firm believer in ignoring the casual terracts and getting on with the peace process.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Yes, the peace process that ends when you masscre every Palestinian

You don't want to negotiate, yet want peace.

[Sirotnikov]

?

no, I didn't believe in massacare then and i still don't now.

i do believe that we should kill every hamas, jihad and fatah member.

i do believe that we should topple the tunis bunch.

i do believe in international aid in serious elections, followed by a rapid peace and disarmament agreement.

hey look, in 2000 i was among the 40%-50% who agreed to barak's moves. and do consider that what was published in israel was more far reaching than what was actually discussed, since barak always leaked more far reaching proposals, to test grounds.

[Sirotnikov]

You're no longer arguing with me but with your stereotype of me.

I know I'm special.

I'm both an extreme righty and extreme leftie. It confuses my Israeli friends too.

[Faboba]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Yes, the peace process that ends when you masscre every Palestinian

I wouldn't say that. If they kill all the oposition there is no more fighting. No war, means peace.

[chequita guevara]

Let me try a simple question. Is it cost effective to create five new terrorists to get one old one?

Look, you cannot get rid of all of the crazies in the world, even in a perfect society. You will always have to deal with some people who will want to do evil to you. You have a choice as to the number of them, however. You can repress as hard as you can until you think the genie is back in the bottle, and build up the pressure so when you finally do loosen things up, it explodes, or you can try and stop doing the things which cause otherwise moderate people to lose any hope of getting justice who then resort to violence.

[Sirotnikov]

It Depends.

Is the old one about to commit a terrorist attack right now? If so yes.

If not - then no.

If I keep him alive will I save more lives?


Btw, che - you're talking as if Israel all of a sudden lost it and invaded.

don't forget the stages from October 2000, when palestinian violence was prevalent and Israel merely responded.

Now they say that 'can't stop terror, due to Israeli troops being there'.

Well what prevented them stopping terror before Israeli troops entered? They only entered in late 2001.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Chris 62
I ever say i supported these clowns?

I know you don't I started on a hypotheical situation that became an actual one.

Che, Che, Che, what has become of you?
You should turn in your party badge.
You don't become a terrorist, you become a revoluntionary, a VERY different animal.
Terrorism gets you nowhere.

And that's what I would argue to them. That terrorism only brings down the irrational arm of the law.Both sides feed the other. At some point the cycle has to break. I think I can make more headway appealing to the rational side and get it to stop doing the things that feed the irrational side than vice versa.

These people are my enemies also. They would kill me as soon as look at me. I have no illusions that I could even make headway with them. But I know who I can make headway with, and that's the millions and millions of frstrated Arabs and Muslims if we stop doing the things that piss them all off, extremist and moderate alike. An extremist is a frustrated moderate. If I can stop the frustration, I can stop the create of more extremists. It won't stop all of them. But I'd rather have 100 enemies than 10,000.

[DinoDoc]

Re the claim that the IRA bombed it way to the peace table: That seems like sophistry to me considering the fact that the British have always been willing to talk to the IRA, but they are not today anymore willing to make concessions to terrorism than they ever have been. The current crop of IRA terrorists have gained nothing more through the use of such tactics than did Michael Collins.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Sirotnikov
Btw, che - you're talking as if Israel all of a sudden lost it and invaded.

don't forget the stages from October 2000, when palestinian violence was prevalent and Israel merely responded.

That moderation was only in your mind. Israel was still stealing Palestinian land and water, still occupied most of Palestine, still expanding the settlements, still humiliating the Palestinian people. And it was going on before the mass of Palestinian violence.

[Sirotnikov]

Che - then what's the problem of doing both things?

Both ridding of extremists and treatment of the causes?

Why do lefties choose to ignore every path that is calling for ridding of those factors?

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by DinoDoc
Re the claim that the IRA bombed it way to the peace table: That seems like sophistry to me considering the fact that the British have always been willing to talk to the IRA, but they are not today anymore willing to make concessions to terrorism than they ever have been. The current crop of IRA terrorists have gained nothing more through the use of such tactics than did Michael Collins.

The Brits didn't negotiate with them before the Troubles started, did they? The Brits let the Protestants run roughshod over the Catholic community. Britain's precondition was always that the IRA lay down its arms first. The recent talks, the IRA didn't have to lay down its arms first, just agree to a cease-fire and negotiate the destruction of arm to be done at a later date.

And Michael Collins was able to drive the Brits out, so he certainly got something accomplished.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Sirotnikov
Che - then what's the problem of doing both things?

Both ridding of extremists and treatment of the causes?

Because they way you (an we) are going about the one precludes the other.

I'm not saying we ignore the terrorists and let them go on hitting us. Obviously they need to be dealt with. Because, as I said, thy aren't going to go away just because we start doing right by the majority. But by getting rid of the desperation that feeds them, every loss they suffer isn't like swatting a hydra.