Which Civilization has been the biggest bunch of bastards throughout history?

[Ethelred]

Originally posted by Serb


Do you know how many people live there and how old is this state?

I think both of the states in question have been around for a long time. The populations however may be smaller than the number of years.

Then again, how can you be sure about body counts.

Can't. Don't claim to either. Ranavalona for instance is based on population estimates and I have no idea how they could have been done accurately since no European wanted to hang around an avatoir and I doubt if Ranavalona gave a damn how many died as long as they were mostly people she didn't like.

And one more thing, what happen in Russia in 20 century is not of your consern, its our local Russian showdowns. You can't understand it.

Can YOU? Can anyone understand Stalin signing off on around 3000 people a day for decades?

The Romans I understand.

There was board game of the Russian revolution in the US in the 1970's or maybe it was the 80's. There were multiple sides in the game and a player could controll more than one side. It was actually possible to win the game by attacking yourself to increase your points.

[Ethelred]

Originally posted by Tolls
He's thinking of San Marino, where the sheep come from...

Thank you. Thats the one. I was giveing TWO examples but I could only remember one name.

Are the men there real Men and are the sheep nervous?

[Sprayber]

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dp

[Sprayber]

Originally posted by Serb


No.
But anyway it's a stuipid and offending poll, I didn't voted.
Can you show me one, single nation who acted like saint during its history? I guess not, then how can you determinate wich one is the worse?

I agree. But I voted for the French anyway.

[Serb]

Originally posted by Ethelred
Can't. Don't claim to either. Ranavalona for instance is based on population estimates and I have no idea how they could have been done accurately since no European wanted to hang around an avatoir and I doubt if Ranavalona gave a damn how many died as long as they were mostly people she didn't like.

If you can't be sure about true numbers (it's simply impossible), then you can't choose the worse civ.

Can YOU? Can anyone understand Stalin signing off on around 3000 people a day for decades?

I can understand how it happen and why it happen, but I can't explain this. You should be a Russian to understand how was it possible that people considered a terribale despot who constantly killing them as the god, and worship to this men as the god. You just can't understand it, it's about our mentality.

There was board game of the Russian revolution in the US in the 1970's or maybe it was the 80's. There were multiple sides in the game and a player could controll more than one side. It was actually possible to win the game by attacking yourself to increase your points.

That's what I can't understand.
Which sides? How player can control two sides at once? What was the goal of the game? How one could win? Was it strategy or may be a RPG?
Sorry, I just can't understand this.

[ZoboZeWarrior]

Originally posted by Sprayber
As for the actual question of the thread. It's France hands down. They are bastards even when they aren't strong enough to do anyting really bad.

Choose a finger ... not the two on the right neither the two on the left !

[Serb]

Originally posted by Sprayber


I agree. But I voted for the French anyway.

You did it twice like this post? You really don't love them much then. What did they done to you/

[Ethelred]

Originally posted by Serb


If you can't be sure about true numbers (it's simply impossible), then you can't choose the worse civ.

Rubbish. I don't need exact numbers.

I can choose without any numbers for that matter. See Spreyber's vote.

Remember if in doubt blame the French. What the heck was Napeleon doing in Moscow anyway? What was he doing in Egypt for that matter besides stealing antiquities?

I can understand how it happen and why it happen, but I can't explain this. You should be a Russian to understand how was it possible that people considered a terribale despot who constantly killing them as the god, and worship to this men as the god. You just can't understand it, it's about our mentality.

Now that you put it that way I think I do understand. Russians are masochists.

People like to claim others don't understand when there is nothing rational to understand and they don't want to admit it.

I do understand though. Lay off the vodka and start drinking something you can taste.

That's what I can't understand.
Which sides? How player can control two sides at once? What was the goal of the game? How one could win? Was it strategy or may be a RPG?
Sorry, I just can't understand this.

It was the Russian Revolution. When the minority party gets a away with calling the majority party the Minority Party reason is not in season.

Don't ask me about the details. I had better sense than to play that game. My brother told me about it. His kitchen pantry has LOTS of space for food. Its full of games instead. Maybe twenty percent is food the rest is games and thats not counting the PC games he has upstairs. I try to be a bit more selective.

[Sprayber]

dp again

[Sprayber]

Originally posted by ZoboZeWarrior




Choose a finger ... not the two on the right neither the two on the left !

like this you mean


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[SlowwHand]

Rome isn't winning in a landslide?
Oh, come on now!

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by Sikander
I wonder why no one who voted for America has the balls to make their case?

You wouldn't have a very easy time making one for France or England either...

Personally, on the choices that were there I was torn between Turkey and Spain, but the Mongols should have been included.

[KrazyHorse]

For those of you claiming that the pop. of all of the Americas was 5 million, please remember that Tenochtitlan alone, for instance, held 200 000 people and was but one city of a vast empire, and even the island of Hispaniola had a pop. as high as 1 million prior to Colombus' arrival. Some links for you to chew on:

http://www.kcl.ac.uk/kis/schools/hums/geog/cw/hgla/aboriginal.pdf

(The only estimate lower than 50 million cited there was made in 1929. The newer estimates range upwards from 50 million)

http://popindex.princeton.edu/browse/v62/n2/d.html

62:20078 Newson, Linda A. The population of the Amazon basin in 1492: a view from the Ecuadorian headwaters. Transactions of the Institute of British Geographers, Vol. 21, No. 1, 1996. 5-26 pp. London, England. In Eng.
"Recent archaeological, ethnohistorical and ecological evidence has begun to challenge the view that `civilizations' failed to develop in the Amazon basin due to limitations of the tropical forest environment. As a result, estimates of the native population in 1492 have become an issue of debate. These estimates are evaluated in the light of the ethnohistorical research on the Ecuadorian headwaters. Estimates are considered by examining estimated habitat densities, the impact of Old World diseases and contemporary evidence for native cultures. The study is based on documents found in archives in Quito, Seville, Madrid and Rome. It is suggested that the population of the Amazon basin in 1492 probably exceeded 5 million but that expectations of substantially higher populations appear unfounded."

This gives a figure of 5 million for the Amazon basin alone

http://www.univ-tlse2.fr/rech/cprs/expos/indian.html

In French, giving pop. estimates of 60 or 80 millions

[Jay Bee]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse

Originally posted by Sikander
I wonder why no one who voted for America has the balls to make their case?

You wouldn't have a very easy time making one for France or England either...

That one. coming from a Canadian, was particularly brilliant


Tell me, how many Canadians (or North Americans in general) have Indian blood? And how many Mexicans? Of course that will mean little if anything to you.

As to the Americans, well, I haven't voted and regard this as one of the most bigotted threads in all of Apolyton history, but I can't forget Hiroshima or Nagasaki. Remember please that these atrocities occurred in the XX century, well after the Protestant Reformation, the French Revolution and the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, the American Constitution, etc etc

So, in the end, a case could be made for all countries on Earth, not only the usual ones that some of you guys seem to have an obsession for.

[kolpo]

Because of the Third Reigh would I want to vote for Germany but I like modern Germany because they trade a lot with Belgium(if they would ever declare an economic embargo would the Belgian economy be dead) so my vote goes to Austria and I also like Germany in general because they have produced good muciscians,philosophers and even some scienctific people so my vote goes to Italie.