Why Gay Olympics??

[MrFun]

There were a few more negative things in addition to the visit with our priest.

My two of my three sisters who have their own families -- they do not want my nieces and nephews to know that I'm gay yet. It has been very difficult to understand why they're afraid to tell them, but so far, I have respected that over the last three years.

And, with one of my two brother-in-laws, I found out how homophobic he really is.

Plus, any partner of mine that I would have in the future I am sure would not be welcomed by my relatives outside the immediate family for family gatherings.

[General Ludd]

Originally posted by MrFun
There were a few more negative things in addition to the visit with our priest.

My two of my three sisters who have their own families -- they do not want my nieces and nephews to know that I'm gay yet. It has been very difficult to understand why they're afraid to tell them, but so far, I have respected that over the last three years.

And, with one of my two brother-in-laws, I found out how homophobic he really is.

Plus, any partner of mine that I would have in the future I am sure would not be welcomed by my relatives outside the immediate family for family gatherings.

Families tend to have relationships like that, regardless...

Atleast, mine does.

[orange]

Originally posted by MrFun
Ok Orange, if you want to make jack-ass of yourself, go make a t-shirt that says Straight-Pride and celebrate how white straight men had to overcome sooooo much discrimination.

That's entirely unfair. Why does someone have to overcome discrimination in order to be proud of something that he is?

[vlad]

Originally posted by MrFun




I am originally from a small town of only 300 people, where just about everyone was Catholic. It was surrounded by farms and their fields.

Guess what?? Even in that village, there were two lesbians there, but they felt that they had to move because it was way too uncomfortable there. I cannot blame them.

What I mean with smaller towns, is that most of them probably have at least one or two gays or lesbians, or bisexuals.

You exaggerated my statement about small towns.

Ok now make up your mind is it one or 2 or is it 5%?? I didn't exaggerate anything. Bisexuals are not considered gay by the way since gay means to have a same sex partner and not be just sexually experimenting.
The point here is that rural areas seldom have gay folks because they migrate to the city where being gay is much more tolerated. This in turn changes the % of the big city, but makes the % non-existant in the rural area. Madison is a prime example with a larger than normal gay population. At one point it had the 4th highest per capita gay population in the US, but none of those people were born in Madison. They migrated as many have to San Fransisco, Houston and Amsterdam.

[MrFun]

Originally posted by vlad

Ok now make up your mind is it one or 2 or is it 5%?? I didn't exaggerate anything. Bisexuals are not considered gay by the way since gay means to have a same sex partner and not be just sexually experimenting.
The point here is that rural areas seldom have gay folks because they migrate to the city where being gay is much more tolerated. This in turn changes the % of the big city, but makes the % non-existant in the rural area. Madison is a prime example with a larger than normal gay population. At one point it had the 4th highest per capita gay population in the US, but none of those people were born in Madison. They migrated as many have to San Fransisco, Houston and Amsterdam.

I never said that bisexuals and gays were of the same sexual orientation. There are three sexual orientations:

heterosexuals, homosexuals, and bisexuals

But I definitely agree with you -- most homosexuals or bisexuals prefer to leave the small towns they were raised in.

And Orange, go ahead -- make a Straight-Pride t-shirt and walk in public places. I'm sure all the people who are ignorant of sexual orientation issues will applaud for your coming out. You must be a closeted heterosexual.

[orange]

Originally posted by MrFun
I never said that bisexuals and gays were of the same sexual orientation. There are three sexual orientations:

heterosexuals, homosexuals, and bisexuals

Asexuality is a real thing, as well, as a matter of fact.

And Orange, go ahead -- make a Straight-Pride t-shirt and walk in public places. I'm sure all the people who are ignorant of sexual orientation issues will applaud for your coming out. You must be a closeted heterosexual.

What the **** is your problem? I never said that I want to make a straight-pride T-shirt. What I'm saying is, it's unfair for people to view one type of pride as just that, pride, and another type of pride as racism.

We are in a new age where all people are equally represented and have equal opportunity BY LAW. Fighting for black rights or gay rights is a good thing when they are not being represented equally. For example - homosexuals should be fighting for their right to join the military and not get kicked out if it's found out that they're homosexual. However, holding "Gay Games" implies that the games are only for Gay people, and that is NOT NECESSARY as homosexuals are allowed to compete in the normal Olympics. Same with student unions. There is NO reason for it at all!

[MrFun]

Originally posted by orange


Asexuality is a real thing, as well, as a matter of fact.



What the **** is your problem? I never said that I want to make a straight-pride T-shirt. What I'm saying is, it's unfair for people to view one type of pride as just that, pride, and another type of pride as racism.

We are in a new age where all people are equally represented and have equal opportunity BY LAW. Fighting for black rights or gay rights is a good thing when they are not being represented equally. For example - homosexuals should be fighting for their right to join the military and not get kicked out if it's found out that they're homosexual. However, holding "Gay Games" implies that the games are only for Gay people, and that is NOT NECESSARY as homosexuals are allowed to compete in the normal Olympics. Same with student unions. There is NO reason for it at all!

First off, you do not have to use vulgar, profane language to show off your intelligence.

Secondly, my mind is made up on this issue, and your mind is made up on this issue.

I do not understand the need for a separate Gay Olympics, but I do support gay-oriented organizations in the communities that welcome straight allies. At least you and I can PARTIALLY agree on this issue.

Since you still do not understand how the history of minority groups justifies their affirmation of their identity, I think we have run into a brick wall in this discussion.

And when you look at the history of minority groups, you will realize why white, heterosexual men have no need to affirm their identity in the same way that minority groups do.

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

Originally posted by orange


What the **** is your problem? I never said that I want to make a straight-pride T-shirt. What I'm saying is, it's unfair for people to view one type of pride as just that, pride, and another type of pride as racism.

We are in a new age where all people are equally represented and have equal opportunity BY LAW. Fighting for black rights or gay rights is a good thing when they are not being represented equally. For example - homosexuals should be fighting for their right to join the military and not get kicked out if it's found out that they're homosexual. However, holding "Gay Games" implies that the games are only for Gay people, and that is NOT NECESSARY as homosexuals are allowed to compete in the normal Olympics. Same with student unions. There is NO reason for it at all!

The "pride" movements are aimed at redressing the balances and giving a boost to minorities. When it's a dominant majority that asserts the "pride" then it can't help but come across as a declaration of superiority and an attempt to maintain imbalance. That's particular true of "white pride"- I don't think it's possible to rid it of the stench of the KKK.

Do we need a "white pride" or "straight pride"? For a dominant group to come out with that just smacks of bitterness and rampant insecurity. What's more "white pride" and "straight pride" sound terribly dull- lots of stiff-necked and self-righteous humourless corpses jerking arhythmically to determiniedly non-groovy music. Would anyone want to be associated with that?

Come on- let's have someone try asserting the heterosexual white males are now the oppressed underclass. I could do with a laugh.

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Bugs ****ing Bunny


The "pride" movements are aimed at redressing the balances and giving a boost to minorities. When it's a dominant majority that asserts the "pride" then it can't help but come across as a declaration of superiority and an attempt to maintain imbalance. That's particular true of "white pride"- I don't think it's possible to rid it of the stench of the KKK.

Do we need a "white pride" or "straight pride"? For a dominant group to come out with that just smacks of bitterness and rampant insecurity. What's more "white pride" and "straight pride" sound terribly dull- lots of stiff-necked and self-righteous humourless corpses jerking arhythmically to determiniedly non-groovy music. Would anyone want to be associated with that?

Come on- let's have someone try asserting the heterosexual white males are now the oppressed underclass. I could do with a laugh.

Bugs, did you read my response to the same quote you responded to??

Thanks for your input, Bugs.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by mindseye
The idea was to create a forum where gay people could get together to compete, show off their athletic prowess, and enjoy some solidarity while publically shooting down an old sterotype.

So you are saying that they don't think they can succeed equally with other athletes, hence they need a special event?

Originally posted by mindseye
Maybe if you tried living as a minority in a straight-drenched world you could understand the joyous sensation of release and freedom that accompanies the rare opportunity of being in a large crowd of people like yourself.

Is the sensationalism a bit too thick here? There are other minorities in this world as well and some of them did not ask for any special treatment at all.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Bugs ****ing Bunny
The "pride" movements are aimed at redressing the balances and giving a boost to minorities. When it's a dominant majority that asserts the "pride" then it can't help but come across as a declaration of superiority and an attempt to maintain imbalance.

I have no objections against raising the awareness of these injustices, but I cannot agree with giving any minorities a special boost.

Again this causes resentment among people who may otherwise support the cause(s), and declare that they cannot achieve it on their on merits.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Tingkai
Yeah, let's cancel the Commonwealth Games cause all it does is give Commonwealth nations special rights and that creates hatred against the Commonwealth.

By your logic then, all sports event should be cancelled because that creates a hatred towards athletes.

[Giancarlo]

Hey Orange clean out your Private Message Box, it is full...

Here is my response to your message:
I can't lie to myself anymore so there will be no excuses. So this is the way I am.

[Caligastia]

Originally posted by Bugs ****ing Bunny


The "pride" movements are aimed at redressing the balances and giving a boost to minorities. When it's a dominant majority that asserts the "pride" then it can't help but come across as a declaration of superiority and an attempt to maintain imbalance. That's particular true of "white pride"- I don't think it's possible to rid it of the stench of the KKK.

The "pride" movements of minorities are probably only temporary phenomenon anyway. As more of them realize that more people accept them (and as more people do accept them) the urge to assert their "pride" will decrease.

Originally posted by Bugs ****ing Bunny
Do we need a "white pride" or "straight pride"? For a dominant group to come out with that just smacks of bitterness and rampant insecurity. What's more "white pride" and "straight pride" sound terribly dull- lots of stiff-necked and self-righteous humourless corpses jerking arhythmically to determiniedly non-groovy music. Would anyone want to be associated with that?

I dont have a problem with "Gay Games", but I think calling it "The Gay Olympics" would create division like Orange was saying. Good thing they changed the name.

[mindseye]

So you are saying that they don't think they can succeed equally with other athletes, hence they need a special event?

Um, no. Maybe you should try reading it again. This time pay more attention to the part about solidarity, the part about deflating stereotypes, and the part about not feeling welcome in traditional sports venues.

Is the sensationalism a bit too thick here?

What I wrote is spoken from my own personal experience and that of my closest friends. If you are not part of "hidden" minority, you can have no idea how liberating and exhilarating such an experience is. I have never experienced anything else quite like that rush.

There are other minorities in this world as well and some of them did not ask for any special treatment at all.

Who said gays were asking for special treatment? Okay, I mean who besides you. Re the Gay Games, gays are just looking for a fun sports venue where they feel welcome and comfortable, and enjoy the company of large numbers of other gays from all over the world. Why does that bother you? What exactly is the special treatment you are talking about?

but I cannot agree with giving any minorities a special boost

Who's asking for a "special boost"? Why do you keep bringing up this straw man? The argument that gays are somehow asking for "special" rights is a particularly tired, threadbare old strawman.

Again this causes resentment among people who may otherwise support the cause(s), and declare that they cannot achieve it on their on merits.

Do you "resent" gay people because you cannot participate in the Gay Games? Do you resent the Girl Scouts? In Calfornia they hold the annual "Gathering of the Clans" - athletic and music competitions for Scottish people - do you think they are asking for a "special boost"? Are girls and Scottish people promoting resentment against themselves? Or do your arguements only apply to gays?

By your logic then (...)

FYI Tingkai was being ironic.