The Most Dominating Aircraft Ever?

[Lonestar]

Originally posted by Serb
one more try

I see it.

In the '80's there was a Joint German-American effort along those lines. The Su-35 is nothing new.

[Serb]

As for WW2, IL-2 Ilyushin-2 (Black Death, Flying tank) is the best plane.

"The "Flying Tank" of the Soviet Air Force, the Il-2 has the distinction of being the most produced aircraft in history at a total of 36,163. After the prototype was flown in December 1939, the production line was quickly opened and the aircraft entered combat in July 1941, just after the German invasion. From that point on the Shturmovik (armoured attacker) became a highly effective ground attack aircraft through to the end of the war with successive versions being fielded as late as the Korean War. Surrounded by armour 4 mm to 8 mm thick, the aircraft's pilot, engine and fuel tanks were difficult to hit from above and below, making the Il-2 near impervious to fighters and flak. Such rugged construction, combined with several cannon and lowlevel flying, made the aircraft a pivotal piece of flying artillery in opposing the German advance, then throwing it back. The initial single-seat versions proved vulnerable, so a second seat was added for a rear-firing gunner. Later versions were fitted with two 37 trim cannon which could punch through most tank armour. The standard Soviet nozhnitsi (scissors) tactic decimated German columns and trains by flying pairs or line abreast Il-2 formations in opposing, cross over lowlevel S-turns, concentrating firepower while confusing anti-aircraft gunners and fighters...

(from Jane's Aircraft of World War II)
"

http://www.aeronautics.ru/il2.htm

[Serb]

Originally posted by Lonestar


I see it.

In the '80's there was a Joint German-American effort along those lines. The Su-35 is nothing new.

This is the picture of SU-47 (S-37 Berkut)
This is the fighter of fifth generation and it is absolutely new, it's the only close competitor is F-22.

[ravagon]

Originally posted by Lonestar
I dare say The Excalibur could kick yer Avro's arse.

I don't really think the excaliber had atmospheric capability.
If that's not a requirement, I'll take a Vorlon Planet-Killer with mustard on top.

[Tingkai]

Originally posted by Urban Ranger


What about the Me-109, the Me-190, and the Me-262?

The Spitfire and ME-109 both had advantages and disadvantages of the other so neither really dominated.

This is what an RAF website has to say:

"The various strengths and shortcomings of the Messerschmitt, the Hurricane, and the Spitfire largely cancelled out in combat. The Hurricane's comparative weakness in acceleration was offset by its extreme strength and ruggedness. There was little to choose between the Spitfire and the Me109 between 12,000 and 17,000 feet, but above 20,000 feet the Messerschmitt was undoubtedly the better machine. It dived faster than its opponents, but required much more physical effort to fly. The weak, narrow undercarriage caused many accidents, but despite this and the cramped cockpit, the aircraft was popular with its pilots."

See: http://www.raf.mod.uk/bob1940/me109.html Great stuff on the Battle of Britain.


The ME-262 was innovative, but the Mustang could hold its own against it, which says something about the Mustang.

The Mustang was also a match for the FW 190.

[Case]

Originally posted by Tingkai
I'd say the Zero because simply the best fighter in the Pacific for most of the war (until the arrival of the Corsair). The Zero was fast and maneuverable. The only way the Americans could compensate for their inferior fighters was to create team tactics.

Bah! the Zero was a piece of garbage. While it's maneuverability and the skill of its pilots were crucial in Japan's early victories, the Zero lacked both the armament and armor needed to survive against the better built American fighters.

[Tingkai]

Originally posted by Case


Bah! the Zero was a piece of garbage. While it's maneuverability and the skill of its pilots were crucial in Japan's early victories, the Zero lacked both the armament and armor needed to survive against the better built American fighters.

Ahh, who needs armour if they can't hit you.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Lonestar
I see it.

In the '80's there was a Joint German-American effort along those lines. The Su-35 is nothing new.

Then how come no US plane - current or in the pipeline - is of this superior design? The forward sweeping wing is inherently unstable and requires computerised correction constantly. However, it is far more maneuverable than conventional designs such as the F22.

IIRC, the F-22 has not solved the problem with vectored thrust vs stealth because it doesn't have strong enough engines. OTOH, the Russian craft has far more powerful engines so it can have vectored thrust and stealth at the same time.

[Serb]

Originally posted by Urban Ranger
The forward sweeping wing is inherently unstable and requires computerised correction constantly. However, it is far more maneuverable than conventional designs such as the F22.

The planes with forward sweeping wing is the desin for planes of the future. I'm glad that we are ahead of all planet in this field.
When I saw what things that plane able to do I was shoked. It able to do impossible, unspeakable things.

[Alexander's Horse]

Originally posted by Case


Bah! the Zero was a piece of garbage.

Well I never heard someone say that before. The Zero is widely regarded as a very elegant and deadly piece of fighter design.

It should be compared with other designs from the 1930's to appreciate it. It swept the skies in 1941.

[faded glory]

Originally posted by Urban Ranger




Russia's aerodynamics is about 15 years ahead of the US. Just look at the MiG-25. It's stainless steel and can still fly so fast.

Russian MiGs are DECADES behind us. Where have you been? The MiG-29 is no match for the F-15. All the MiG's suffer from a detretmental lack of electronics.


Ask yourself, when was the last a MiG shot down an American made plane?

Try 1973.

Dogfighting yes,the MiG's are superior. But somebody needs to tell those crusty russian generals Dogfighting is an obsolete concept ; when Radar guided Ammram's can take you out 15-30 miles away.


Yes the Russians had good cheap alternatives. But they just dont match up. The Electronics in a MiG-29 (80's) werent even on par with are 60's era F-4's. An Soviet AAM's have a very poor performance.

[Alexander's Horse]

Originally posted by Serb

The planes with forward sweeping wing is the desin for planes of the future. I'm glad that we are ahead of all planet in this field.

Oh - I thought they just made a mistake putting the plane together.

[faded glory]

Oh say what you want about dogfighting and all that. But nobody has ever out manuevered an Israeli or American F-15. Argueably the best interceptor on earth.

[Serb]

Originally posted by Alexander's Horse


Oh - I thought they just made a mistake putting the plane together.

Try to make such kind of mistake. I'll supose after all your efforts you'll be able to make such "mistake" only after 15-20 years and only if you steal our technology.

[ravagon]

Originally posted by Alexander's Horse


Oh - I thought they just made a mistake putting the plane together.