Bisexuals

[MrFun]

Boddington, correct if I am mistaken, but you seem to advocate social double standards -- one set of standards for behavior for heterosexuals that are separate and different from behavior acceptable for homosexuals or bisexuals.

Heterosexuals can talk freely about their wives/husbands, fiances/fiancees, and boyfriends/girlfriends without risking hostile reactions.

Heterosexuals can hold hands with their significant other in public places without a risk of being subjected to hostile reactions.

Heterosexuals can talk about their significant other at the work place without risk being fired or reprimanded for doing so.

If you are saying that those same behaviors are not acceptable from homosexuals and bisexuals, then you are advocating social double standards.

When you complain about "pushing it in my face," you seem to imply that you advocate social double standards.

[Solly]

Originally posted by MrFun
Boddington, correct if I am mistaken, but you seem to advocate social double standards -- one set of standards for behavior for heterosexuals that are separate and different from behavior acceptable for homosexuals or bisexuals.

Heterosexuals can talk freely about their wives/husbands, fiances/fiancees, and boyfriends/girlfriends without risking hostile reactions.

Heterosexuals can hold hands with their significant other in public places without a risk of being subjected to hostile reactions.

Heterosexuals can talk about their significant other at the work place without risk being fired or reprimanded for doing so.

If you are saying that those same behaviors are not acceptable from homosexuals and bisexuals, then you are advocating social double standards.

When you complain about "pushing in my face," you seem to imply that you advocate social double standards.

So you would advocate paedophiles talking about how they fancy kids and beastialites talking about how they fancy animals on the main street?

Parents don't want their kids exposed to that kind of nonsense.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Boddington's
So you would advocate paedophiles talking about how they fancy kids and beastialites talking about how they fancy animals on the main street?

Here we go again.
Let's start equating paedophiles with gays. Yeah, that's the ticket.
Look: Paedophiles who act on children should be locked up. They are criminals in that they exploit minors.
Homosexuals are heterosexuals, except it involves two men/women instead of one man and one women.
It hurts no one.

If heterosexuals are allowed to disucss how they fancy the other sex, by what logic do you deduce that homosexuals should not be allowed to discuss how they fancy the other sex?

Is it because you think it's icky? Is it because you don't understand it?

I think seafood is disgusting. I hate it. The smell, the taste, everything. Should I therefore lobby that it be banned and shunned from public simply because I don't like it and don't understand how people could?

Parents don't want their kids exposed to that kind of nonsense.

Parents are teaching their kids to be tolerant these days, Stewie.
Parents don't want their kids exposed to the nonsense that you're spewing.

[*End Is Forever*]

Fine... reply to the trivial parts. There's a surprise.

But anyway...

I listen to some goth, punk and metal music and hence gain knowledge about the cliques from the lyrics

Care to share some examples with us, Stew?

visit various web forums about them

You trolled the RW board for a short while... that hardly counts.

visit various such nightclubs in Manchester and am a cautious member of some clubs here at uni

Other than on Thursdays, where you basically stay in the punk room and within your own group friends and people you know, I recall you going into Rockworld once (on a Saturday night), sitting in the corner and generally being miserable, before leaving early. If you're classing 5th Avenue, MutzNutz or (the late) Venue as "alternative clubs" then it shows you don't know what you're talking about.

I think this helps me to see the general extremely liberal mindset of these cliques, where to be seen as anything other than "open-minded" is perhaps the most important thing of their existence.

What utter bull****. By their very definition cliques are close-minded. You wouldn't seem to know a clique if it came up and screwed you up the arse. Anyway, the idea that you would show that you were "open-minded" by becoming bisexual is quite frankly ludicrous.

--------

I know you know several bisexual people Stew... let me remind you... Zac, Paul and Jenn... do you think they're doing it to be "trendy"? Did you not see the hell at least one of them went through? Are you talking out of your arse again?

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Boddington's


So you would advocate paedophiles talking about how they fancy kids and beastialites talking about how they fancy animals on the main street?

Parents don't want their kids exposed to that kind of nonsense.

You are definitely making distorted statements that seem to be based on bigoted bias.

And, you're using fallacies in that argument. Here is why:

Homosexual and bisexual relationships are based on sex and/or love between two consenting adults.

Pedophilia involves manipulating, and using children for sexual pleasure -- it does not involve two consenting adults.

Beastiality behavior involves sex between an animal and a human -- there can be no love or meaningful intimacy that exists in relationships between two humans.

You have used some serious flaws in your arguments, Boddington -- not to mention that they are bigoted and biased. Homosexual and bisexual relationships are not nonsense -- they are as legitimate as any heterosexual relationship between two consenting adults.

[Solly]

Asher,

If heterosexuals are allowed to disucss how they fancy the other sex, by what logic do you deduce that homosexuals should not be allowed to discuss how they fancy the other sex?

Is it because you think it's icky? Is it because you don't understand it?

Listen, I don't homosexuals or bisexuals, but if they keep details of whatever they do in private to themselves, they won't piss anyone off.

I think seafood is disgusting. I hate it. The smell, the taste, everything. Should I therefore lobby that it be banned and shunned from public simply because I don't like it and don't understand how people could?

You generally don't get the smell of seafood forced upon you walking down the main street. (And luckily at the moment we don't get the sight of two guys holding hands)

Let's start equating paedophiles with gays. Yeah, that's the ticket.

Paedophiles aren't necessarily criminals (they have to actually acton their paedophilia to be one). Should they be able to talk about how they'd love to do whatever to some young child in front of everyone? No. People don't want to hear or see it.

Originally posted by *End Is Forever*
You trolled the RW board for a short while... that hardly counts.

I visit other bands forums too (Ataris, Juliana Theory, Smashing Pumpkins, Propagandhi plus other bands you haven't heard of)

Other than on Thursdays, where you basically stay in the punk room and within your own group friends and people you know, I recall you going into Rockworld once (on a Saturday night), sitting in the corner and generally being miserable

Saturday nights are a pile of bollocks in Rockworld. Oh, and relevance?

If you're classing 5th Avenue, MutzNutz or (the late) Venue as "alternative clubs" then it shows you don't know what you're talking about.

I don't see the relevance...

What utter bull****. By their very definition cliques are close-minded.

In what way? These cliques are close-minded that they only accept people who are way too liberal for their own good.

You wouldn't seem to know a clique if it came up and screwed you up the arse.

I think I see more cliques than you manage to...they're everywhere in Rockworld - but it doesn't stop them trying to "prove" that they are "open-minded". I would think that since you're more into the poppunk clique you won't actually notice the demands the clique puts on you.

For example, ever been to Rockworld with a band shirt on...?

Anyway, the idea that you would show that you were "open-minded" by becoming bisexual is quite frankly ludicrous.

You wouldn't actually *become* bisexual, but say you were and force yourself to do one or two acts in order to "prove" it either to yourself or to others.

I know you know several bisexual people Stew... let me remind you... Zac, Paul and Jenn... do you think they're doing it to be "trendy"?

I don't know, everyone has their reasons for everything. I've not really talked much about the topic with anyone.

Did you not see the hell at least one of them went through?

Everyone has difficult times finding who they are. I don't think that's a fundamental part of bisexuality but rather just a process of growing up.

MrFun,

Pedophilia involves manipulating, and using children for sexual pleasure -- it does not involve two consenting adults.

OK, so in your eyes so long as two adults consent, they can do whatever they like around other people?

You have used some serious flaws in your arguments, Boddington -- not to mention that they are bigoted and biased. Homosexual and bisexual relationships are not nonsense -- they are as legitimate as any heterosexual relationship between two consenting adults.

That argument is flawed.



Bisexuality by defintion can't be between two consenting adults. It has to be with three.

I am not bigoted at all, just trying to stick up for those who are afraid to post among this liberal mass at Apolyton their true thoughts for being shouted down as bigoted or homophobe. They don't dislike homosexuals, just the act being forced in their faces when it doesn't need to be!

OK, I'm going off to do some research about this, see what I can find.

[MikeH]

Originally posted by Boddington's


People tend not to argue their true viewpoints on the internet..

I hope that's self referential.

Mind you I don't know what would be worse. To actually be a small minded bigot or just to want people to think you are one.

Where did you get that 99.9% stat from anyway? It's obviously complete bollocks. I'd like to see a link to the research papers or an article about them or something. I gave you links for the animal homosexuality stuff, not great but I found them in a few seconds.

[MikeH]

Originally posted by Boddington's

Bisexuality by defintion can't be between two consenting adults. It has to be with three.

I am not bigoted at all, just trying to stick up for those who are afraid to post among this liberal mass at Apolyton their true thoughts for being shouted down as bigoted or homophobe. They don't dislike homosexuals, just the act being forced in their faces when it doesn't need to be!

No, it doesn't require 3 people. Bisexuality means that a person finds men and women attractive. It doesn't mean they are automatically into threesomes or whatever. They can have monogamous relationships or not just like everyone else. They might go out with a man for a while then a woman then a man or they might meet a person they love and never see anyone else despite their attractions to people of both sexes. They have exactly the same variety of promiscuity or non-promiscuity as any other person.

And you are bigoted. You are trying to enforce discriminatory behaviour on people. Suggesting that samesex relationships are wrong and that practicing it is disgusting and by inference the people that practice it are disgusting. I don't care if there are other people who think like you, that doesn't mean you aren't bigotted, it means that they are too.

Frankly your opinions disgust me.

[Provost Harrison]

I'll take this one as I doubt Iain will be around for a while. He'll be in bed until the afternoon you know

Originally posted by Boddington's


Listen, I don't homosexuals or bisexuals, but if they keep details of whatever they do in private to themselves, they won't piss anyone off.

Why do you care Stew? They aren't coming on to you. Why do you care? Insecure?

You generally don't get the smell of seafood forced upon you walking down the main street. (And luckily at the moment we don't get the sight of two guys holding hands)

Walk past any fishmongers. I guarantee you the sight and smell of seafood is quite evident And what is wrong with two guys holding hands? They have found each other and are having a relationship (presumably). Isn't love a beautiful thing? Isn't it the same thing you are striving for? Is it any less beautiful because it isn't within your sexuality and your close-minded model of 'normality'?

Paedophiles aren't necessarily criminals (they have to actually acton their paedophilia to be one). Should they be able to talk about how they'd love to do whatever to some young child in front of everyone? No. People don't want to hear or see it.

As we have said, paedophilia is a completely different kettle of fish. It isn't about two consenting adults, it is about one individual praying on minors. Talking about it raises massive problems, especially if the other people have children or are involved with children. But again, you don't get it.

I visit other bands forums too (Ataris, Juliana Theory, Smashing Pumpkins, Propagandhi plus other bands you haven't heard of)

Try me.

Saturday nights are a pile of bollocks in Rockworld. Oh, and relevance?

Not my musical cup of tea either. I don't have a chip on my shoulder about it though do I? I guarantee you that the people are a damn sight more friendly than in any mainstream club I have ever come across though.

I don't see the relevance...

Well they are 'indie clubs' if anything, quite mainstream too. That is the relevence. You are referring to the wrong people.

In what way? These cliques are close-minded that they only accept people who are way too liberal for their own good.

I think they'll find they are cautious towards you. That is because of the anger and filth you spew from your buccal cavity. They'd rather avoid you because they know what you are like from your Rockworld board shenanigans. You've made a rod for your own back on this one. I have no such problem whatsoever, as I have said, I always find the people there very friendly and outgoing. And if you haven't already noticed, you've earned yourself a similar reputation around these parts. Try talking to Ross or red_jon about what they feel about you. Ross thought he could could you as a friend, now he really isn't so sure. People don't seem to be bothered any more whether you attend poly meetings any more. And that wasn't the case a year or so ago where people were keen on meeting you. Your actions or conduct here are not isolated. People do judge you on them.

I think I see more cliques than you manage to...they're everywhere in Rockworld - but it doesn't stop them trying to "prove" that they are "open-minded". I would think that since you're more into the poppunk clique you won't actually notice the demands the clique puts on you.

Now you're just spouting total drivel. You now seem to be saying that open-mindedness is a bad thing. Again, you have made the rod for your own back here as discussed previously. Your reputation proceeds you.

For example, ever been to Rockworld with a band shirt on...?

Yes thanks, quite often. It is actually quite a good source of conversation if nothing else. People who come up to you and say they like the band and they are cool. It is a damn good icebreaker believe it or not. But you are too bull-headed to really figure this out.

You wouldn't actually *become* bisexual, but say you were and force yourself to do one or two acts in order to "prove" it either to yourself or to others.

Why in the name of f**k would anyone want to do that? Words escape me towards the extent of your stupidity. BTW Stew, I'd keep your mouth shut at uni, because you never know which of your friends could come out. With people like you, it makes it all the more difficult for them. Besides, you know gay people at university. Do you talk like this to him? I bet he isn't aware of it. Well you try picturing how he must feel knowing that there are people like you in his circle of friends but doesn't even know. I've seen this at first hand with a friend of mine at uni petrified about coming out to another friend who comes across as somewhat homophobic. He couldn't do it, but knew it needed to be done, that is terror. I told him myself in the end. That is how bad it is. You have no idea how unpleasant and uncomfortable you could be making a friends like Stew. Personally I think it is a shame when people have to worry about the opinions of a brainless bigot and still somehow regard them as a friend. It is a true label of their character.

I don't know, everyone has their reasons for everything. I've not really talked much about the topic with anyone.

It is truly sad Stew. These are close friends. You know, I am tempted to completely humiliate you and get Zac to come here and read your rantings. How clever would you feel then? I don't believe you can hold these opinions with your experience of this. I know I have talked to Zac at great length at these things, and he certainly isn't doing it to be 'cool'. If you think that, you really don't deserve Zac as a friend

Everyone has difficult times finding who they are. I don't think that's a fundamental part of bisexuality but rather just a process of growing up.

I would expect most males during adolescence think about it. But it takes one hell of a lot more than 'thinking about it' to come out to friends and family now. It takes conviction and knowing oneself. Again, talking about something you don't have the vaguest inkling about

Bisexuality by defintion can't be between two consenting adults. It has to be with three.

I think you have just exposed the most wide, gaping hole in your argument. Three people? We are talking about bisexuality, not menage-a-trois. Jesus, read up Stew, talk to people, get out there in the real world. It's really not what you think it is.

[MikeH]

Excellent post PH.

[Provost Harrison]

I'm just tired of it Mike. Stew is a friend of mine, and I thought he was maturing and improving, but he has taken a massive step backwards with this stuff. I don't get it.

He says he is right-winged now. I think with his sermons that the his political affiliation is closest to that of the British Nationalist Party.

[ZoboZeWarrior]

Originally posted by Boddington's
Paedophiles aren't necessarily criminals (they have to actually acton their paedophilia to be one). Should they be able to talk about how they'd love to do whatever to some young child in front of everyone? No. People don't want to hear or see it.

Why comparing gay and paedophies Bob ? There is no connection.

I've heard a lot of good fathers (apperently) raping their own childrens ...
Please don't use such arguement for fire hatred.

Of course, people want not to listen a paedophile talking about his/her lust. Not because it is simply disgusting, but because they realize that the guy is harmfull for their childrens and proud to be it.

A gay who said that he love men ... why not ... Adult people are big enough to make their choice and defend them-self.

[MikeH]

Originally posted by Provost Harrison
I'm just tired of it Mike. Stew is a friend of mine, and I thought he was maturing and improving, but he has taken a massive step backwards with this stuff. I don't get it.

He says he is right-winged now. I think with his sermons that the his political affiliation is closest to that of the British Nationalist Party.

I know. I don't really understand it. He seemed like quite a nice guy when we all met up in London but this is... well I don't know what to say really.

[Kropotkin]

Possibly to much alcohol in combination with the wrong kind of company or to little alchol in combination with the wrong kind of company...

[Provost Harrison]

The thing is, I have been over to Aberystwyth and met his mates and they are a cool lot, which is what is baffling me even more I don't know where he is getting it from. I think the republicans have assimilated him and stuck probes in his brain