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Galileo -- Why?

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  • #31
    Such as be no dependent on EE.UU

    Don't miss my mind: I think that EE.UU and EU will be allies, but EU can be some-what more independet with this...
    Also, our tech-related industry will be grateful...
    Trying to rehabilitateh and contribuing again to the civ-community

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    • #32
      Originally posted by DinoDoc
      paiktis22: Mississippian!!!! Stupid boy lover.
      Oh that's great! Just because I don't know how to spell that damn Mississippi's burning or something, not only am I stupid but I also have a funcy for boys!

      Great work there Monneypenny

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      • #33
        Originally posted by paiktis22
        not only am I stupid but I also have a funcy for boys!
        I thought that was the standard insult for Athenians.
        I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
        For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

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        • #34
          paiktis: A lot, silly. On its face, it means that yaroslav's perception about Europe's space technology dominance has little connection with reality.

          In fact, Galileo could represent to the EU/Canada what the space station represents to the US--a great white elephant that sucks up too high a %-age of the space budgets. There are a lot of things that Europe could do with this money that would help y'all make a mark in space technology. Instead, y'all want to spend it on 30 year old tech. I'm asking why the decision was made.
          I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891

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          • #35
            Originally posted by DinoDoc

            I thought that was the standard insult for Athenians.
            Maybe so in 3000 B.C. Now the insults have grown much worse

            DanS,
            I still fail to see the connection between number of flights and technological superiority... I mean Columbia could take on and off as many times as it needed, how does that necessairily translates to contniuous advancement of techs?


            About the 30 year old tech I'm afaird I only have your word for it

            As to why it is being constructed I think that taking off from the reliance to US space is something that is indeed important.


            BTW ESA is used for commercial reasons only. Artemis just puts satellites in orbit.

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            • #36
              "As to why it is being constructed I think that taking off from the reliance to US space is something that is indeed important."

              But it doesn't do that! It's a bogus argument! Read above where I said that the US--with current tech--could jam Galileo, just as we can can and do with GPS. You are just as reliant on the good graces of the US, if push came to shove.
              I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891

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              • #37
                Originally posted by DanS
                paiktis: A lot, silly. On its face, it means that yaroslav's perception about Europe's space technology dominance has little connection with reality.
                Well, I'm speaking of satellites launches. I think that Europa has more market percentage than USA and this has to have a reason not?

                But, as always, I can be wrong.

                European space technology needs more funds and more political support. One of the things that I envy from USA is the importance that their politicals put on technology...

                [When in the last post EE.UU I was refering USA. Sorry, in spanish EE.UU=USA]
                Trying to rehabilitateh and contribuing again to the civ-community

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by DanS
                  But it doesn't do that! It's a bogus argument! Read above where I said that the US--with current tech--could jam Galileo, just as we can can and do with GPS.
                  That is indeed bad

                  Mind you I know next to nothing on the issue but having the infastructure there and then imrpove on it seems to me better than just having void.

                  I mean you can build on a system from the moment you have it up and running and I wouldn;t exclude the ultimate combination of all european national satelites into one big ass network. (I think they ony thing that prevents it for the time being is that military/security remains on national level).

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                  • #39
                    "I think that Europa has more market percentage than USA and this has to have a reason ¿not?"

                    No, Europe doesn't have more market percentage than the US, if Russia isn't considered as part of Europe. As stated above, it's much less.
                    I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891

                    Comment

                    • #40
                      Originally posted by DanS
                      KH: The US could jam Galileo just as easily as it could/does its own GPS system.
                      Nope; it doesn't have to jam its own GPS system; it just has to start using a different encryption code. This retains usage for US military, but not for anybody else. Having a separate system means that the US has to commit some act of war to restrict access. What if, God forbid, Turkey attacks Greece. US sides with Turkey, EU with Greece. US shuts down GPS for non-cleared (non-US/Turkish forces). US might do this but not be willing to start jamming EU sattelites' signals (which may or may not be possible, BTW) because that would constitute an AOW against owners of Galileo.

                      US seems to be worried that Galileo won't obey them, so this is obviously an important issue to Washington.
                      12-17-10 Mohamed Bouazizi NEVER FORGET
                      Stadtluft Macht Frei
                      Killing it is the new killing it
                      Ultima Ratio Regum

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                      • #41
                        In fact, Galileo could represent to the EU/Canada...
                        Where does it say we'll be spending money on it?
                        12-17-10 Mohamed Bouazizi NEVER FORGET
                        Stadtluft Macht Frei
                        Killing it is the new killing it
                        Ultima Ratio Regum

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                        • #42
                          You guys are an ESA cooperating member, so I guess you'll pay some CDN$...

                          "What if, God forbid, Turkey attacks Greece. US sides with Turkey, EU with Greece. US shuts down GPS for non-cleared (non-US/Turkish forces). US might do this but not be willing to start jamming EU sattelites' signals (which may or may not be possible, BTW) because that would constitute an AOW against owners of Galileo."

                          Interesting scenario, but you're not taking into account how it works.

                          The US can narrowjam in the theater of operations, like we're doing in Afghanistan. We don't need to do anything nasty to the sats. Either way, it's GAME OVER for Galileo.
                          I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891

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                          • #43
                            Either way, it's still an AOW. The US might be breaking contracts if it cuts service to Greece, but that's entirely different than interfering with somebody else's property. Remember that I'm not suggesting that the EU or US are belligerents; they're simply "interested parties".
                            12-17-10 Mohamed Bouazizi NEVER FORGET
                            Stadtluft Macht Frei
                            Killing it is the new killing it
                            Ultima Ratio Regum

                            Comment

                            • #44
                              You guys are an ESA cooperating member, so I guess you'll pay some CDN$...
                              I doubt we've signed on for a fixed percentage of all projects. I could be wrong, but I'd assume that we get to decide on a case-by-case basis.
                              12-17-10 Mohamed Bouazizi NEVER FORGET
                              Stadtluft Macht Frei
                              Killing it is the new killing it
                              Ultima Ratio Regum

                              Comment

                              • #45
                                Originally posted by DanS
                                The US can narrowjam in the theater of operations, like we're doing in Afghanistan. We don't need to do anything nasty to the sats. Either way, it's GAME OVER for Galileo.
                                Maybe, maybe not. Also don't forget electronic warfare is a two-way street. You can jam them, they can jam you.
                                (\__/) 07/07/1937 - Never forget
                                (='.'=) "Claims demand evidence; extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan
                                (")_(") "Starting the fire from within."

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