Who lost China's Internet?

[Atahualpa]

Found a good article about the Internet Situation in China. Read here: http://www.weeklystandard.com/Conten...0/922dgmtd.asp

FREEDOM OF SPEECH!!

These Chinese Officials treat human rights with their shiny commie boots AND WE LICK THEM!!!!!
Governments like the Chinese should not be supported in ANY way. **** the big market!

ata

[DinoDoc]

Re: Who lost China's Internet?

Originally posted by Atahualpa
These Chinese Officials treat human rights with their shiny commie boots AND WE LICK THEM!!!!!
Governments like the Chinese should not be supported in ANY way. **** the big market!

What's your opinion of the American embargo on Cuba?

[Transcend]

Do you think embargos ever work? Cuba, North Korea, Irak don't seem to change for the better.

I'm all for making businesses with these countries. We make big bucks, and lots of their people will become very pissed, thus forcing changes.

[Dis]

Is there some law that says China must treat their citizens with the same rights as americans?

Just further proof that americans think their way of life should be forced on everyone.

If the chinese didn't like it they could revolt

[Clear Skies]

Ugh, I hate this debate...

I'm a devil's advocate in and of myself. I'm forever seeing both sides of the argument and, while I normally support one, I can see exactly where it's wrong and the other is right.

However, I believe that certain human rights (freedom of speech, movement, thought, life, etc.) are completely essential and as such should never ever ever ever be infringed. End of story. China doesn't uphold them, therefore China is wrong. Period.

[ranskaldan]

Re: Who lost China's Internet?

Originally posted by Atahualpa

These Chinese Officials treat human rights with their shiny commie boots AND WE LICK THEM!!!!!
Governments like the Chinese should not be supported in ANY way. **** the big market!

ata

And you think that by stopping trade or boycotting the Olympics or whatever, you are going to HELP the situation? Isolating and closing China will only foster resentment among the Chinese for the West, and strengthen the commie government's position. Oh yes, if you stop trade right now, you're doing the commies a real big favor - they have so much more propaganda to use, and they have greater ease of survival and doing mischief (like killing people, for instance) in a country that's more closed.

I mean, I don't like the commies either, but for goodness sake, don't punish the Chinese people because of their rulers. It's almost like those sanctions on Iraq and Cuba. The rulers sit in their shiny palaces and have parties while the population suffers from the sanctions. Of course, the rulers will bring on their latest anti-American speeches and that only makes the population support their rulers more.

If you really want to help, then bring in the trade! Only with communication can this situation ever be changed. Censored communication, yes. But closing everything results in no communication, and that's much worse.

[Velociryx]

It's easier to distroy than to create. So we let them build their firewalls. WE built the damned things, and we can surely figure ways around them at a significantly faster pace than they can counter our "ways around." In the end, the genie that is the free-flow of information *cannot* be contained. China's leadership is living in a dream if they believe otherwise.

-=Vel=-

[Dis]

exactly.

While I don't agree with restricting freedom of speech (although the U.S. and Europe does it to a small extent- I long for the day I can say bomb on an airplane JK ). I don't agree with sanctions for that nation.

As has been pointed out above. Information will get through. Goverment action does not accomplish things (at least for our weak democracies ). But freedom of speech does accomplish things (for better or for worse). Eventually things will change. Patience is the key. But enforcing dumb sanctions won't accomplish much. Providing China with even more internet access will accomplish much more.

Long hail the flow of information- no matter how bad it is

[Atahualpa]

well cuba doesnt treat its citizen like dogs!

Human Rights is one thing that EVERY COUNTRY ON ****ING EARTH HAS TO ACCEPT AND ENFORCE!!!!

And no I dont think that an embargo would help much BUT the way it is now, everybody being ****ing nice to them, not saying a word about all those ****ing forced abolitions, students that get ****ing slayed, "other" thinking people that get arrested and ****ing shot. Nobody ****ing complains! ****ing hell!!!

Dont greet these idiots formally. Dont travel there. Treat this government like they treat their citizen!
When they want something they have to beg to get it. Nothing will be offered to them!

I hate stupid governments thinking they know so much ****ing better.

ata

[Caligastia]

Havent you heard? Humans dont have rights.

[General Ludd]

They are all playing the same game.

Originally posted by Atahualpa Human Rights is one thing that EVERY COUNTRY ON ****ING EARTH HAS TO ACCEPT AND ENFORCE!!!!

And no I dont think that an embargo would help much BUT the way it is now, everybody being ****ing nice to them, not saying a word about all those ****ing forced abolitions, students that get ****ing slayed, "other" thinking people that get arrested and ****ing shot. Nobody ****ing complains! ****ing hell!!!

Dont greet these idiots formally. Dont travel there. Treat this government like they treat their citizen!
When they want something they have to beg to get it. Nothing will be offered to them!

I hate stupid governments thinking they know so much ****ing better.

Typically speaking, politicians don't rag on each other unless they have something to gain from it.

[Ecthy]

does your avatar show a masturbating smiley?

[General Ludd]

Originally posted by Ecthelion
does your avatar show a masturbating smiley?

Yes. Deal with it.

[ranskaldan]

Originally posted by Atahualpa
well cuba doesnt treat its citizen like dogs!

Human Rights is one thing that EVERY COUNTRY ON ****ING EARTH HAS TO ACCEPT AND ENFORCE!!!!

And no I dont think that an embargo would help much BUT the way it is now, everybody being ****ing nice to them, not saying a word about all those ****ing forced abolitions, students that get ****ing slayed, "other" thinking people that get arrested and ****ing shot. Nobody ****ing complains! ****ing hell!!!

Dont greet these idiots formally. Dont travel there. Treat this government like they treat their citizen!
When they want something they have to beg to get it. Nothing will be offered to them!

I hate stupid governments thinking they know so much ****ing better.

ata

I understand that you have a lot of hatred for commies, but I'd say that "not traveling there", "not trading" and so on are not the way to help the nation get rid of the commies.

It's like you have a headache. Are you going to say, "I hate this ache" and then try to crush your own skull in order to destroy the ache? I don't think so.

What you're advocating, basically, is to get rid of communism in China by destroying the country's economy and livelihood of its people in the process.

Sometimes I wonder, do you hate communism because you want to help the people who have suffered under it? .... or do you hate it just because, you hate it?

If you hate communism because of the cruelty it inflicts on its people, then for goodness sake don't join it in inflicting even more cruelty. The Chinese don't have rights. Don't take away their income too. I'd say that, between a commie bureaucrat who's taken away your right to demonstrate, and an American who's denied you the right to eat, you'd hate the American more.

[Caligastia]

I think its ****ing cool.