Israel I'm getting a clear picture

[Natan]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse
All of which again assumes that neither actually has it in them to live in peace with the other.

Allow me to quote from the section of the Fatah Constitution which appears under the heading goals

Article (12) Complete liberation of Palestine, and eradication of Zionist economic, political, military and cultural existence.

And these are the so-called moderates in the Palestinian political spectrum.

They should find a goddamn modus vivendi already.

That would be absurd - through the doctrine of destroying Israel in stages, the Palestinians have already explained the starting point of negotiations - give us everything you can and we'll use it to attack you.

By the way, you can sneer all you want at the outsiders who try and pressure for peace, but at least I'm sure that most of their hearts are in the right place

I'd say they fall into two categories:
1) The morons who believe that wars are simply the result of misunderstanding.
2) The cynical and self-interested who can see that it's to their advantage for the region to stay quiet as the oil comes out.

and I'd rather have them for neighbours than the population of either the PA or the State of Israel.

Actually, I think that individual Palestinians and Israelis are much nicer people than individual Germans or Frenchmen.

Keygen: The main problem with the Jordanian solution is that it would be hard to move three million Palestinians from the West Bank and Gaza accross the Jordan, and that it's not clear whether water supplies in Transjordan would be sufficient to support them.

[ZoboZeWarrior]

Originally posted by Natan
Actually, I think that individual Palestinians and Israelis are much nicer people than individual Germans or Frenchmen.

And so what ? That a typical stupid answer...

"PA are my foes, but I respect them 'individually'. But All strangers who defend the PA are only cynical jerks bla bla bla ..."

Please stop generalizing.

[Natan]

Originally posted by ZoboZeWarrior
"PA are my foes, but I respect them 'individually'.

So you believe that if you have political disagreements with an organization, it's only right to hate all members of the same ethnic group?

But All strangers who defend the PA are only cynical jerks bla bla bla ..."

Perhaps I should have made it more clear, but I was reffering to the governments (and government diplomats) who have been playing make believe with the region for many monthes, if not years, now. I was not refering to regular individuals.

[Az]

after all said and done , Zobo , the french government , with it's support of regimes such as Syrian government , is one of the biggest obstacles to peace . The hypocricy is simply flowing out of their holes . The aren't enough words for me to say all the bad things I want to say . It's pretty clear that the people upstairs around there want to get the muslim vote. I have absolutely no doubt about that . I guess I can't blame them . They ARE politicians.


IParis, by the way.....

[Sirotnikov]

Originally posted by Keygen
How sure can you be that the modern Palestians in their majority are descendants of the ancient nations that lived there?
So many tribes from the entire middle east and central asia inhabited in Palestanine...

I don't get the point.

I don't care who they are.

They want a country - fine. So did we.

So let them have half of Palestine and live there without terrorizing me. Otherwise I'm gonna break their bones.

And the arabic world is crying for Palestinians having not their own land
I always was wondering despite the obvious difficulties since all arabs are supporting the independence of the Palestinians so strong why they didn't ever bothered to provide a small area in Jordan near the borders with Israel to the Palestinians to have their independent state.
Now I hear that most of Jordan's inhabitants are accually Palestinians! Here's the solution.
Jordan gives its west part and Israel gives part of east bank and Palestinians have their own state!

Well, between 48-67 the west bank was under jordan occupation.

That would be nice and would end the middle east issue but I don't think that some leaders would be thrilled about it, including Sharon and possibly the Americans and Saudi Arabs...

I dunno.
I think it would be swell. Sharon doesn't mind the principle of a pal state. He'd just prefer that we keep as much land as possible. But he'll give what he has to.

It is true that when guns speak instead of peace talks then terrorism in all forms from both sides is endless.

eh.
Morally comparing the two sides is not correct, though i admit we often do bad things, which, had I been in power, people would have been publically punished for, and severely.

Yes, you're right but what's your point?
That you grand the tactic that Germans were killing 10 and some time 100 civilians for the death of a single German officer simply because the enslaved people were fighting for their freedom?

It's completely irrelevant that they are enslaved.
I find it a fearsome tactic to use with any enemy.

You kill 1 of our own, we kill 10 of yours to teach you a lesson.

Unfortunately, we hit much more citizens that we ought to, but it's due to the crowded urban terrain.

Accually Israel wasn't existing for more than 2000 thousand years...

But jews kept on living here, and jews abroad kept praying for Zion (= Jerusalem)

But Greece didn't exist for 2000 years either with the exeption of the Greek rule over Byzantine empire after the 7th century and for 7 centuries.
Ireland didn't exist for 8oo years.
Persia didn't exist for more than a millenium.

Haha!


There must be a point there, and if I wouldn't be so damn sleepy I'd figure it out.

Thanks for the point


You know, other than being humanistic and stuff, you're a great guy (assuming your sex since.. well.. girls aren't often here)

[Sirotnikov]

Btw, other than being quite hypocritical, the french are nice.

But come on, stop sucking up to arabs so much.

[Keygen]

Originally posted by Natan
So you believe that if you have political disagreements with an organization, it's only right to hate all members of the same ethnic group?

I think he was sarcastic Natan quoting your own words

Originally posted by Sirotnikov
I don't get the point.

It is not relevant with the content of the thread indeed.
I was simply putting my comment on your specific comment

Originally posted by Sirotnikov
Well, between 48-67 the west bank was under jordan occupation.

But now it's yours. Well, give it back then but to Palestinians

Originally posted by Sirotnikov
Sharon doesn't mind the principle of a pal state. He'd just prefer that we keep as much land as possible. But he'll give what he has to.

I beleive he doesn't either but as you said as long as he keeps most of it for Israel.
But you know that this is not acceptable for the Palestinians.
So as long as he's supported by the Americans and the Israel people he will continue to claim more land and the blood bath will never end.

Originally posted by Sirotnikov
You kill 1 of our own, we kill 10 of yours to teach you a lesson.

That is perfectly acceptable if kept between soldiers but when enforced to civilians then it is atrocity.

Originally posted by Sirotnikov
But jews kept on living here, and jews abroad kept praying for Zion (= Jerusalem)

Yes, I know. Otherwise I wouldn't support your just for an Israel state

Originally posted by Sirotnikov
You know, other than being humanistic and stuff, you're a great guy (assuming your sex since.. well.. girls aren't often here)

Thanks Siro
Well, I am a male

[ZoboZeWarrior]

Originally posted by Sirotnikov
Btw, other than being quite hypocritical, the french are nice.

Israel gouv isn't hypocritical ?
USA gouv isn't hypocritical ?
Yasser Arrafat isn't hypocritical ?
People of the world aren't hypocritical ?

We, french, are the lone to be hypocritical on this good old planet ?