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  • #76
    Seineldin in his own words

    ARGENTINA
    Seineldín: 'Freedom Now!
    For the Resistance'
    by Cynthia Rush

    On Nov. 23, Argentine political prisoner and hero of the 1982 Malvinas War, Mohamed Alí Seineldín, forcefully intervened into his nation's crisis, by demanding his immediate release from prison, where he has been for the last 11 years, thanks to the efforts of former U.S. President, now Sir George Bush, and his toady, Carlos Saúl Menem, former President of Argentina (1989-99). Bush saw to it personally that Seineldín was locked up, following the former colonel's involvement in the Dec. 3, 1990 uprising against the Army high command, to remove him as an obstacle to Anglo-American policy, particularly the destruction of the Armed Forces.

    As former Colonel Seineldín reports in his statement below, his demand for freedom now, is motivated by the Nov. 20 ruling by Argentina's Supreme Court to absolve Menem of criminal charges related to illegal weapons sales to Ecuador and Croatia in the early 1990s. As Seineldín has stated, Menem was the obedient tool of London and Wall Street, and devastated his nation at their behest. At a moment of extraordinary national crisis, Menem's release from house arrest, and his announcement that he will run for President in 2003, is an ominous sign. Seineldín is therefore demanding his own freedom, in order to lead a national resistance movement to Argentina's further destruction. As a supporter of Lyndon LaRouche's New Bretton Woods proposal for a new global financial system, he is uniquely qualified for that job.

    Campo de Mayo Military Prison
    Nov. 23, 2001

    While I have always fought for the prosperity of my Fatherland (our Second and Great Home), it wasn't until 1988, when, from the events in Panama, I learned of the change in the political model to be imposed on all Ibero-American nations, that I dedicated myself fully to analyzing this issue, studying it in depth, with a view toward the probable future consequences for the citizenry. That model was based first on tearing apart, and then replacing the Republic and the nation-state with a bloc of nations dependent on the United States—the reality we know today as "globalization" or the "New World Order."

    With all the proof and evidence in hand, aside from making this known to all levels of the military hierarchy, government officials, business and trade union leaders, former Presidents, Church leaders, etc., I dedicated myself to alerting all who would listen, to the danger looming over the nation, as a result of [this model's] imposition. Regrettably, I must admit that the response, in general, was poor.

    But, at the beginning of 1989, I was invited by then-Presidential candidate Dr. Carlos Saúl Menem, and was able to present to him the situation that would develop in the immediate future, were urgent action not taken. Dr. Menem ordered me to begin working on a proposal for national defense and security. I thus began working enthusiastically, with no personal ambition, and with absolutely no suspicion of what would later occur.

    While I worked on the assigned task, after only a short time had passed, I realized that I had been fooled, and that Menem, himself, was the agent designated by the United States to impose the "New World Order" on the Republic. Despite my difficult situation, I made my best effort to make him listen, but faced with his repeated refusals, I had no alternative but to resort to the Dec. 3, 1990 military uprising which, while offering few possibilities of victory, would at least serve as a warning to the citizenry of the sinister future awaiting them.

    I won't go into what happened during those ten years of the Menem government—the "Perverse Decade"—because today the results are there for all to see.

    Upon being jailed for life in a common prison, as a result of an arbitrary trial with pre-established sentences, I decided to accept my misfortune and present it as a testimony to my beloved Fatherland, to which I owe so much, and to my dear soldiers who gave their lives during the South Atlantic Campaign [1982 Malvinas War]. I maintained this position for 11 years, without accepting the pardons repeatedly offered by Menem during his administration. My conscience assured me that the old saying, "For justice, God, and for truth, time," would sooner or later become reality. And it did, when worthy judges imprisoned that well-organized "illicit association," whose kingpin was the same President Menem. That encouraged me, even further, to continue giving testimony.

    But, regrettably, on Nov. 20, 2001, coinciding with the Day of Sovereignty,[1] in shameful collaboration with the government, the justice system, and at the initiative of the U.S. government, Menem and his "gang" were freed, to immediately take up the program to hand over what remains of that once-great Argentine Republic, to the "International Empire of Money."

    This cruel circumstance, forces me to now change my mind. Now, I want my freedom! Freedom, for the Resistance!

    For God and Country,

    Mohamed Alí Seineldín

    [1] Day of Sovereignty: for the Blessed Miguel Pró, who was executed for the "crime" of being a priest, and only asked his captors for a few minutes to pray, and die with his arms on the cross. His death is an example of courage and conviction.
    "People sit in chairs!" - Bobby Baccalieri

    Comment


    • #77
      I just want to state something completely wrong with this LaRouche´s idea!

      Originally posted by Jules
      The new Argentine government must initiate criminal proceedings against ex-Presidents Menem and De la Rúa, and Cavallo, for having systematically lied to the Argentine people in hiding the de facto bankruptcy of the country, for the past ten years, and who, in lying to their own people, in criminal fashion, further increased Argentina's foreign debt
      That is absolutely wrong. Cavallo had nothing to do with the excessive borrowing that took place from 1997-1999 when Menem´s term ended. He wasn´t even an economic minister. This guy has his facts screwed up. The counry wasn´t borrowing excessively when Cavallo was economic minister but it started to borrow excessively after he left. I think the only people who should go on trial is the peronist party who ignited the violence on the streets.

      And some of those economic ideas are completely bogus.

      Puerta, though a peronist, has different ideas. He wants to cut government spending and excessive fat. But he won´t accept the provisional presidency, he wants to get elected.
      For there is [another] kind of violence, slower but just as deadly, destructive as the shot or the bomb in the night. This is the violence of institutions -- indifference, inaction, and decay. This is the violence that afflicts the poor, that poisons relations between men because their skin has different colors. - Bobby Kennedy (Mindless Menance of Violence)

      Comment


      • #78
        Here's an interesting development:

        BUENOS AIRES, Argentina (CNN) -- After 12 hours of overnight debate, Argentina's Congress on Sunday appointed Adolfo Rodriguez Saa as provisional president, and he immediately declared a moratorium on the country's massive $132 billion debt.

        Rodriguez Saa, a member of the country's majority Peronist party, will serve until March 3, when new elections will choose a leader for the remaining two years of former President Fernando de la Rua's four-year term.

        De la Rua resigned Thursday after two days of bloody rioting sparked by the country's economic woes. The opposition Peronists had refused de la Rua's call to form a coalition government.

        Outside legislative halls, a small group of protesters banged on pots and pans, complaining that the new appointment would not change things for the debt-ridden country.

        Rodriguez Saa said he declared the suspension of the country's foreign debt because Argentina must first address domestic issues, such as hunger and the unemployment rate, which stands at 20 percent.

        He said his priority was to create an emergency social plan to address these domestic issues with $350 million that was intended to help pay off the country's debt.
        "People sit in chairs!" - Bobby Baccalieri

        Comment


        • #79
          Argies sure have some really smart guys up their sleeve to turn around the economy. And the smartest thing to do is, as always, default on debt (=grand theft writ large)

          With Argy capital creation capacities we'll just have to see where the $$$ will be coming from in the nearest future
          Originally posted by Serb:Please, remind me, how exactly and when exactly, Russia bullied its neighbors?
          Originally posted by Ted Striker:Go Serb !
          Originally posted by Pekka:If it was possible to capture the essentials of Sepultura in a dildo, I'd attach it to a bicycle and ride it up your azzes.

          Comment


          • #80
            Originally posted by Saras
            Argies sure have some really smart guys up their sleeve to turn around the economy. And the smartest thing to do is, as always, default on debt (=grand theft writ large)

            With Argy capital creation capacities we'll just have to see where the $$$ will be coming from in the nearest future
            Defaulting was the best thing they could do.

            They have the infrastructure.
            For there is [another] kind of violence, slower but just as deadly, destructive as the shot or the bomb in the night. This is the violence of institutions -- indifference, inaction, and decay. This is the violence that afflicts the poor, that poisons relations between men because their skin has different colors. - Bobby Kennedy (Mindless Menance of Violence)

            Comment


            • #81
              They have the infrastructure.
              What infrastructure? What are you talking about?
              Originally posted by Serb:Please, remind me, how exactly and when exactly, Russia bullied its neighbors?
              Originally posted by Ted Striker:Go Serb !
              Originally posted by Pekka:If it was possible to capture the essentials of Sepultura in a dildo, I'd attach it to a bicycle and ride it up your azzes.

              Comment


              • #82
                Originally posted by Saras


                What infrastructure? What are you talking about?
                You have no idea what kind of country this is, because you probably never have been here. This country has a $300 Billion dollar GDP according to most recent figures, and there is a large but declining manufacturing sector here. The city of Buenos Aires itself has a large port, and includes many modern buildings.

                Sorry I am late to replying.
                For there is [another] kind of violence, slower but just as deadly, destructive as the shot or the bomb in the night. This is the violence of institutions -- indifference, inaction, and decay. This is the violence that afflicts the poor, that poisons relations between men because their skin has different colors. - Bobby Kennedy (Mindless Menance of Violence)

                Comment


                • #83
                  "
                  Need I say more? If you do not trust it get out of it."

                  Na, we need to stay in the Security Council so we can veto stuff.

                  "Yes! There is absolutely no reason for basic civil liberties, such as freedom of speech, to be abridged."

                  And so during the civil war should Union soldiers needed warrants when occupying Confederate Towns? During times of chaos, it is sometimes neccesary to temporarily suspend civil liberties to restore order- although permanent police states such as Castro's regime are unacceptable.

                  "Pure speculation."

                  It's just as much speculation to say a permanent police state was planned, and it's usually best not to rebel based on speculation.

                  "Bull****. Learning is what life is about!"

                  You may have trouble believing this being in a magnet school and then at an Honors program at a flagship university, but not everyone is an intellectual. Most people couldn't give a **** about learning.

                  Ramo, think about your argument for a second. Education is obviously huge for you know as you are in an university. But once you get out, how much of your life will be spent with education/healthcare. Think of all the other expenses not related to those two. Just because healthcare is adequate does not mean you aren't impovershed.

                  "That's irrelevent to the argument."

                  It is completley relevant to this argument. You are saying the health care is one thing that is good about the Castro regime. But if you are an anarchist, you should not think that the state controling health care is good at all.

                  ". The point is that the quality of life for the average Cuban is undoubtedly significantly better than the quality of life for the average Latin American."

                  Only if you entire life is based on education and healthcare, which is true for few people.

                  "Cuba's stance on civil liberties isn't any worse than most Latin American countries,"

                  Not really. Most Latin american countries are democracies where you are free to protest, and where there are legal opposition parties.

                  "Oh come on, Bautista was practically giving away Cuban property to American businesses."

                  Which were providing jobs for Cuban workers.

                  Ramo, if you want there to be any business dealings in countries that are ruled by dictatorships, you have to have property rights for the businesses dealing with them. The alternative would not be having economic dealings with countries ruled by dictatorships, and that would hurt those peoples even more.

                  If they want to trade with us, they can give back the siezed property.

                  "There was no freedom of speech. No freedom of assembly. Did you honestly expect a fair election?!"

                  If this continued until election time and the Senate refused to do anything, then it would be time to rebel.

                  ". President resigns, Senate takes over."

                  President resigns because of rioters. If it is neccesary to remove a president, have an impeachment.

                  "

                  We don't need a majority vote to know as a society that we want him done away with."

                  Yes, you do. Voting is how we determine the will of the people in democracies.

                  "

                  If the people hadn't deposed him quick, the military would have stepped in."

                  Right, to protect the fairly elected president from de facto rebels.

                  "The military now longer have a reason to step in"

                  Not neccesarily. How likely would it be the military would overthrow a conservative president?

                  If Argentina plunges further into chaos and the Peronists mess up, then the Military has it's cause to re-assert it's rule.

                  Keep in mind, De La Rua still had some supporters. Those people are now going to be very angry, and recognize this government as illegimate and put in place not by voting but by rioting.

                  -------------

                  Jules, perhaps you could try coming up with your own arguments instead of cutting and pasting articles?
                  "I'm moving to the Left" - Lancer

                  "I imagine the neighbors on your right are estatic." - Slowwhand

                  Comment


                  • #84
                    Shi, are you thinking about what you're posting? Are you informed about the situation? Politically, Argentina is in no means the US... people don't vote a president out because the president can get around things. Presidents aren't impeached because they have enough senators and/or deputies on payroll. You have to realise that NO one has supported neither De La Rua or Cavallo. Not even their own parties! Argentina is NOT a democracy where the people rule (now it might be) but a corporativist nation where we have politicians who rule for the multinationals and screw their own people in the arse to maintain the corporations.

                    Secondly, this revolution was necessary. For over 70 years, politicians and parties have been screwing their people. This revolution *should* mark a turning point in Argentine politics. The people has shown the government that they will not let them poke fingers in our arse and now the government will have to take into consideration the needs of the people. As someone already said "if the Peronistas fuk up, the pots and pans are ready". This marks the renewal of the social contract by which the people are once again the retainers of power.

                    Thirdly, these are the wrong statements that are made when you only know isolated information from the country, which I fear is what is happening here. The De La Rua administration has pursued a "prod and watch" policy with regards to the people. Since it began, salaries have been cut down almost 25% and prices remain the same. The doctors in public hospitals are underpaid and the hospitals are terminally undersupplied (and I have seen this). The education is going down the drain as teachers go unpaid for months. De La Rua and Cavallo brought this unto themselves because they should have known that if you prod the bunny too long it'll eventually bite. This is a natural backlash at the past 2 years, when social discontent has risen beyond imaginable size.

                    Comment


                    • #85
                      Merry Christmas Argentina!

                      found it on indymedia...
                      Attached Files
                      "In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act."
                      George Orwell

                      Comment


                      • #86
                        Originally posted by El Awrence
                        Presidents aren't impeached because they have enough senators and/or deputies on payroll.
                        And even with this stupid overthrow the more corrupt people have come to power. Your country has made a very big mistake.

                        Argentina is NOT a democracy where the people rule (now it might be) but a corporativist nation where we have politicians who rule for the multinationals and screw their own people in the arse to maintain the corporations.
                        Screw off. You know that the corporations make the livelyhood of every nation. It accounts for a massive proportion of the gross domestic product. If you had zero manufacturing your country would be a ****hole like Ecuador.

                        Secondly, this revolution was necessary. For over 70 years, politicians and parties have been screwing their people.
                        This was no revolution because the same politicans are there. Saa is mumbling fool who wants to create 1 million jobs out of nowhere. How is he going to do it? With money that isn't there.

                        This revolution *should* mark a turning point in Argentine politics. The people has shown the government that they will not let them poke fingers in our arse and now the government will have to take into consideration the needs of the people. As someone already said "if the Peronistas fuk up, the pots and pans are ready".
                        How about the Turret of a TAM Tank and an Ak-47 rifle... yes that is right if the Peronists **** up the military will take responsiblity. And this time they will follow a model that actually will help the country.

                        This marks the renewal of the social contract by which the people are once again the retainers of power.
                        Oh really? I guess Saa and Menem are really your best bets. How about Ruckauf (SP?)? This little staged overthrow really screwed up your country big time. Instead of four years for a recovery it will take eight.

                        Since it began, salaries have been cut down almost 25% and prices remain the same.
                        Yeah and where would money come from to pay for the salaries? Off the trees?

                        The doctors in public hospitals are underpaid and the hospitals are terminally undersupplied (and I have seen this). The education is going down the drain as teachers go unpaid for months.
                        No it isn't. It is well paid and well supplied compared to all other nations in Latin America except Chile.

                        De La Rua and Cavallo brought this unto themselves because they should have known that if you prod the bunny too long it'll eventually bite. This is a natural backlash at the past 2 years, when social discontent has risen beyond imaginable size.
                        So this staged overthrow by Saa and Ruckauf would makes things better? Now with a million jobs created in Government the deficit will increase some more.

                        The mistakes show the deficiencies in the Peronist parties and this is a perfect chance for the Action for the Republic, a conservative party to replace these squabbling leftists.
                        For there is [another] kind of violence, slower but just as deadly, destructive as the shot or the bomb in the night. This is the violence of institutions -- indifference, inaction, and decay. This is the violence that afflicts the poor, that poisons relations between men because their skin has different colors. - Bobby Kennedy (Mindless Menance of Violence)

                        Comment


                        • #87
                          And so during the civil war should Union soldiers needed warrants when occupying Confederate Towns?
                          During the Civil War, the right to a warrant was irrelevent because, as I wrote earlier, Lincoln took everyone he wanted as political prisoners.

                          During times of chaos, it is sometimes neccesary to temporarily suspend civil liberties to restore order- although permanent police states such as Castro's regime are unacceptable.
                          Why? Why should freedom of speech be abridged? Only tyrants deny to the people basic civil liberties.

                          It's just as much speculation to say a permanent police state was planned, and it's usually best not to rebel based on speculation.
                          The military is quite independent in Argentina. It is not incredible for them to sieze control. What is incredible is that the state declared state of siege for anything but a mechanism of holding power from the people.

                          Most people couldn't give a **** about learning.
                          In the US, that is unfortunately true. Not necessarily elsewhere.

                          But once you get out, how much of your life will be spent with education/healthcare.
                          I hope I continue learning my entire life, and I certainly will need healthcare all my life.

                          Just because healthcare is adequate does not mean you aren't impovershed.
                          But if healthcare is inadequate, as is the case in just about all the other Latin American countries, you are impoverished (unless you happen to stay perfectly healthy your entire life).

                          You are saying the health care is one thing that is good about the Castro regime.
                          I didn't say that. I said that the Cuban quality of life is better than the rest of Latin America.

                          But if you are an anarchist, you should not think that the state controling health care is good at all.
                          I didn't say that. But what I do believe is that if the state steals from the people, it is better that the state provides the people decent healthcare than not (as is the case with many of the US' "capitalist" allies). I'd rather see some of the money go back to the people than it stay in Castro's wallet.

                          Only if you entire life is based on education and healthcare, which is true for few people.
                          No, only if your life necessitates adequate education or healthcare, which true for almost everyone.

                          Not really. Most Latin american countries are democracies where you are free to protest, and where there are legal opposition parties.
                          Uh huh. Free to protest. Tell that to the Argentine people after the state of siege was declared.

                          Which were providing jobs for Cuban workers.
                          How ****ing magnanimous of the Americans, providing jobs to the little brown people. Obviously, they're incapable of owning their own property, so it's a humanitarian gesture to take it off their hands.



                          The Cuban people have enough jobs, thank you, without Yankees stealing from them.

                          Ramo, if you want there to be any business dealings in countries that are ruled by dictatorships, you have to have property rights for the businesses dealing with them. The alternative would not be having economic dealings with countries ruled by dictatorships, and that would hurt those peoples even more.
                          Yep, the US lacks true property rights, due to its trade barriers, so should face an embargo from all countries.

                          If they want to trade with us, they can give back the siezed property.
                          And I repeat, much of this property wasn't legitimately owned in the first place.

                          If this continued until election time and the Senate refused to do anything, then it would be time to rebel.
                          Wait until the state gives the civil liberties back? Is that what you would've done in Soviet Russia? After the Civil War is over, Comrade, our liberties will return.

                          Civil liberties must be taken from the state, not given by the state.
                          "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
                          -Bokonon

                          Comment


                          • #88
                            And even with this stupid overthrow the more corrupt people have come to power. Your country has made a very big mistake.


                            Screw off. You know that the corporations make the livelyhood of every nation. It accounts for a massive proportion of the gross domestic product. If you had zero manufacturing your country would be a ****hole like Ecuador.
                            When Peron was in power in the 1940s and 1950s the countries economy grew via the PyMes. PyMes are the big employers and they may not produce as much as the average third world sweathouse they are the ones that employ and eventually feed a population working in tandem with protective laws.

                            This was no revolution because the same politicans are there. Saa is mumbling fool who wants to create 1 million jobs out of nowhere. How is he going to do it? With money that isn't there.
                            Who else are we going to put in there eh? Shrubya? A general?

                            How about the Turret of a TAM Tank and an Ak-47 rifle... yes that is right if the Peronists **** up the military will take responsiblity. And this time they will follow a model that actually will help the country.
                            The military will not come out of the barracks, stop being such a paranoid idiot.

                            Oh really? I guess Saa and Menem are really your best bets. How about Ruckauf (SP?)? This little staged overthrow really screwed up your country big time. Instead of four years for a recovery it will take eight.
                            This little overthrow showed politicians that the Argentine people are tired of being screwed in the arse.

                            Yeah and where would money come from to pay for the salaries? Off the trees?
                            And where will the food, the houses, the health care and the education that these people need come from? Off the trees?

                            No it isn't. It is well paid and well supplied compared to all other nations in Latin America except Chile.
                            Who gives a damn how it compares to other ****holes? The fact is, patients in public hospitals have to buy their own suture, their own hypodermics and their own shots. Sometimes, their own bandages. Doctors have gone unpaid for months, they work like ******s and they are still paid a pittance. Otherwise tell me why doctors strike and Marta Maffei makes such a racket all the time, huh?

                            So this staged overthrow by Saa and Ruckauf would makes things better? Now with a million jobs created in Government the deficit will increase some more.

                            The mistakes show the deficiencies in the Peronist parties and this is a perfect chance for the Action for the Republic, a conservative party to replace these squabbling leftists.
                            This just demonstrates your complete ignorance. The Accion por la Republica is Cavallo. Cavallo is directly and personally responsibe with Menem for the current situation. Secondly, there are no leftist parties in Argentina save in the "Other- 5%" section of the polls. Justicialista, Radical, Accion x la Republica, all conservatives interested only in their own pockets.

                            Ramo, siege was lifted.

                            Comment


                            • #89
                              You have no idea what kind of country this is, because you probably never have been here. This country has a $300 Billion dollar GDP according to most recent figures, and there is a large but declining manufacturing sector here. The city of Buenos Aires itself has a large port, and includes many modern buildings.
                              That is all fine, but that was not the point of my question - what does having an "infrastructure" have to do with being able to default and not be hurt in the future by it?
                              Originally posted by Serb:Please, remind me, how exactly and when exactly, Russia bullied its neighbors?
                              Originally posted by Ted Striker:Go Serb !
                              Originally posted by Pekka:If it was possible to capture the essentials of Sepultura in a dildo, I'd attach it to a bicycle and ride it up your azzes.

                              Comment


                              • #90
                                they work like ******s


                                I suppose that has different meaning in argentina


                                Argentina is a piss poor example of a government that tried to keep its promised and spent too much. Hell......137 billion in debt? What the **** where they thinking? Recession or not.....you dont spend that much! There was a run on banks and private accounts. And since the banks had already been raided of there capital by the government. They could do nothing.....


                                alas, the collapse.


                                Argentina is a good country. I would never rule her out. I believe she holds a place as the leader of South America. (Not Brazil!)

                                She will recover and prosper...we must all hope.

                                Good luck rebuilding your country El Awarence.

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