Chirac warns of 'catastrophe' of world 'choked' by US values

[DanS]

I watch American movies, eat Indian, Italian and Mexican food, drink Irish beer and Finnish vodka and so on. Still I define myself and my culture as Swedish. Or rather as "Norrlänning" (Northerner/coming from northern Sweden). The choice to adopt parts of foreign cultures as your own is NOT the same to me as loosing your own culture. Culture is dynamic and you just enrich it. If your culture is so useless it can't survive some foreign influences, well good riddance!

Precisely. For example, from what I can tell, most Finns know English rather well (NB: I know that you aren't Finnish). They watch some American TV. They watch American movies. They participate in the English-dominated Internet to a mind-boggling degree. But do we honestly believe that US culture has much impact on the Finnish culture? I suggest that the impact is a lot more limited than some would have us believe.

[Sprayber]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
As for the market tending towards uniformity... that must be why I only eat burgers every day... oh wait, I had Chinese the other night, and Pizza before that, and Mexican last week. Vietnamese a few weeks ago. Perhaps I'll go for Thai, and if I liked Indian, I could get it any time I wanted. All within driving distance. That's not mentioning Japanese (been a while since I've been there), Morroccan and Ethopian foods I can get at any time.

What uniformity?

I hate those damn damn Italians and Mexicans for making such good food that I hardly ever eat home cooked American food anymore

[DinoDoc]

Why haven't we choked the world yet?

[DanS]

I guess we like to savor the moment.

[Moral Hazard]

Alot of Italian food is Italian-American food. Alot of Mexican food is Tex-Mex so no worries there. A good steak or Burger is best though, washed down with Canadian Beer, and a side of french fries. So Im indulging in three cultures every meal.

[DinoDoc]

We're a bunch of cold blooded bastards.

[Pekka]

Right, my apologies for my first rant in this thread. It wasn't very constructive and it was a bit racist

the no AC and no elevator thing is not very cultural thing anyway. And after all this was a bout movies and other kind of cultural influences.

Just for the records, our theaters do play other movies too than Hollywood movies. Hollywood movies are their own genre, just like French movies and domestic ones. I like them all. Hollywood.. you can't compare it to other genres. Because they are different genres in a way. Hollywood usually has good production, and all that good stuff. And they make lot of movies too and promote them more aggresively. Of course there is nothing wrong in that. But Hollywood movies ARE made more for the American audience than others. And of course they are, would be pretty stupid if they weren't. Other 'genres' like French films (well these are not official genres), UK films etc etc, they have their own style. Smaller production, but good production values. Usually more subtle, and it's not so much to your face action type of films. But they are different genres. Doesn't make the other one any worse or better. I like them all, if I like them. It's not because it's Hollywood, or Swedish or what ever.

And on the contrary too, non-Hollywood movies are made, and in big numbers too. They do get lot of time in our theaters too, because they are succesful in here. Some of these films would never be succesful in the US. So they don't even bother trying it. Just like the 'man without past' created some interest even in the US, but the fact is, Kaurismäki has made those kinds of films for years and years and years, and we are very familiar with them and even before this one he was considered as a legend and many of his cinematographical displays of our lives and the weird dialogues and most of all the lack of them are famous in here and there are many sayings that are known like 'Oh this is just like from Kaurismäki' if you'd enter a weird situaton where no one talks and it's just generally weird. But still common .

These movies are good for us, and there are lots of them. The thing is, they are nto succesful in the US because you guys are not into that kind of stuff. So you might get an idea that no one else is making films, which is of course pretty weird though

And hell yes that is seen as arrogant, because we know we have films all the time, it is you who don't get to see them . It's like the claim that no one else is making music. Or popular music. that's crap claim too, they might not be popular there. Some bands, some films, what ever the format is, have been usually extremely popular in their own countries and areas for years and years and years, and some of them break it in the US as well, and suddenly 'hey one foreigner made a film too' .

Get it?

[Sprayber]

Originally posted by Moral Hazard
Alot of Italian food is Italian-American food. Alot of Mexican food is Tex-Mex so no worries there. A good steak or Burger is best though, washed down with Canadian Beer, and a side of french fries. So Im indulging in three cultures every meal.

You see America has wormed its way into those to, we are evil bastards.

[Japher]

We have a place here that bills itself as Cal-Mex here. Very good. Lots of real Mexican food too, and I don't mean Tex-Mex or something tailored ot american tastes, same goes for Asian foods... I think it depends on where you live.

Still....

Resistance is Futile. You WILL be assimilated.

So grin and bare it.

It's a small world afterall.

[DinoDoc]

SuperCitizen will be assimilated by the American onslaught! Your cultural distinctiveness will be added to our own! You will adapt to service us!

[Pekka]

"Precisely. For example, from what I can tell, most Finns know English rather well (NB: I know that you aren't Finnish). They watch some American TV. They watch American movies. They participate in the English-dominated Internet to a mind-boggling degree. But do we honestly believe that US culture has much impact on the Finnish culture? I suggest that the impact is a lot more limited than some would have us believe."

This is a good argument and I would agree. This would trash my first rant in this thread pretty good and I apologize for it again. I just got irritated by this stereotype that I have in my mind of flag wavers calling my penis small .

I think what we are really talking about is entertainment business. Yes, the American entertainment business and it's impact in entertainment in here is the single biggest one. But it's not the ONLY one . And when people say that you have nothing of your own all you do is watch our stuff, well that's offensive kind of, because we do have our own stuff and lots of other peoples stuff too. Most of those people naturally have never been in here too,so that's why it is offensive. It creates a situation where people would think we have to bend over and go to our knees and thank everyone for the gifts and pleasures Hollywood has brought to us, as if it's the be all and end all of every single movie we see and like.

[Pekka]

DD, what are you talking about. I am American. It just doesnt' say so in my passport.

[DinoDoc]

See! We always win out in the end!

[DanS]

And when people say that you have nothing of your own all you do is watch our stuff, well that's offensive kind of, because we do have our own stuff and lots of other peoples stuff too. Most of those people naturally have never been in here too,so that's why it is offensive.

Hey, no American (that I can remember) has pushed that line in this thread. That's Chirac's and Oncle Boris' line of argument.

[Pekka]

I know. And I said some of you will never get it. I didn't mean anyone in this thread, but in general. But I HAVE countered that claim before, but granted not in this thread.