Your Reactions to the First Debate

[Alexander's Horse]

Originally posted by Dissident

I'm also thinking about getting a crossbow. that seems like the best self defense weapon.

Why? Are you expecting an invasion by Visigoths?

[MrFun]

Ted Striker


Ted Striker falling asleep in my thread

[Thorn]

Stop threadjacking, or I'm going to start ranting in inintelligible German and yelling at you people!

[Mad Bomber]

Originally posted by Harry Tuttle



Well I have a a decade of bad SNL to back me up, so ping away.

Ok.. Al was bad on SNL, point taken, but read his book, not only does it do a good job of setting the liberal record straight, but it also is quite humorous at times (well, unless your a Bushie)

[Harry Tuttle]

EDIT: I hope Thorn read my German

[Moral Hazard]

Boshko saved it. Destroying evidence.

[Bosh]

The gf says that Kerry looked "wise and strong" and Bush looked "stupid strong and very stubborn" and that both don't know the details of the Korean situation and are using it for politics for whatever its worth.


Since I'm lazy I'll do a Mr. Fun, here's my original post on the other thread:

Bush just kept on pounding and pounding the talking points "wrong war" "mixed messages" "wrong war" "mixed messages""wrong war" "mixed messages""wrong war" "mixed messages""wrong war" "mixed messages""wrong war" "mixed messages""wrong war" "mixed messages""wrong war" "mixed messages""wrong war" "mixed messages""wrong war" "mixed messages""wrong war" "mixed messages" He did a good job of it if you like that sort of performance (although I wanted to throw something at him when he COMPLETELY dodged the first question in order to hit his talking points) but it was pretty boring.

Kerry was a bit all over the place and didn't counter Bush's main talking points hard enough. I think his best bit was the anecdote about De Gaulle and JFK about how America's credibility with the world has been damaged. I don't think that he did quite enough to pound home how much more difficult Bush's alientation of most of the world will make it for us to gather an alliance in the future or how much of America's credibility Bush has burned. So Kerry did more of a real debate, Bush did more of an advertising campaign but its a bit of a toss-up which is more effective since Kerry didn't pound some of his criticisms home.

Hmmm what else? Bush pissed me off when he claimed credit for the formation of the Department of Homeland Security when it happened despite his opposition to it, it seems that Bush likes claiming credit for things he originally opposed. Also the bit where he says he knows what Iraqi soliders are going through because he gets to sit in his comfy chair and real casualty lists what pretty laughable.

As far as the non-verbal BS that the press obsesses about, Kerry definately won. He was far better than Bush at remaining composed while the other person was talking and it really showed in the cut-away shots. Also he never spoke out of turn and Bush did serveral times in order to signal that he wanted his 30 seconds.

So a marginal victory for Kerry. Also keep in mind that as long as it was even relatively close, this is going to help Kerry in the polls since Bush was well in the lead in the polls on the issues they talked about.

So maybe:
Kerry B
Bush C+

I thought Bush stayed on message and was forceful. He was a little too antsy at times.

Kerry got his shots in. He strayed into irrelevancies at times.

Sounds a bit right


I think that Kerry will also do well in the post-debate debate. The media likes obsessing about BS that doesn't matter like body language, sighing and all that crap. Kerry definately beat Bush in that. He remained composed when Bush was talking and had much more control over his body language than Bush and didn't inturrupt Bush at all.

And his justification: "I know the war in Iraq is hard-I sit and sign the orders!"

Yeah that burned me up a bit.

I thought that Bush did have Kerry on the defensive on his message on the war in Iraq, but Kerry answereed this in the end.

He should have done more though. He should have gone after Bush on more Iraq specifics and offered more specifics besides blathering about summits.

Bush was disciplined and stayed on message, and certainly didn't do horribly, but Kerry got out too many damning accusation which weren't fully rebutted that I think may stick in the minds of undecided voters.

Right, Bush didn't do much in the way of specific rebuttal. If this was a formal debate Bush would've been destroyed, of course it isn't so this one issue doesn't hurt Bush all that much.

Has anyone here had their mind changed by this exercise, or know someone who has?

I'm much less likely to vote third party out of frustrated disgust now.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Kerry won.

On a purely stylistic outlook, Bush was "pulling a Gore" and interrupted Kerry and smirked/rolleyes when Kerry was speaking. Wasn't very smart on his part.

[Shi Huangdi]

According to Drudge Report, a C-Span reporter overheard some Kerry operative led by Lockhart, who concluded that the race was a draw.

[Ted Striker]

Next debate is supposed to be a Town Hall type of debate.

This might be the opportunity for Kerry to shine because of the two, Bush is the more scripted kinda guy.

Though, his arrival at the World Trade Center in the aftermath of Sept 11th, he did really well with all the impromptu stuff.

[Koyaanisqatsi]

I think Kerry won, but then, I'm biased against morons.

The general consensus on the UMaine BBS is that Kerry won, but it doesn't matter since it wasn't memorable. (They've tended to lean slightly right in the past.)

[MrFun]

After having seen the debate, my confidence in Kerry has definitely strengthened.


As I watched and listened, I could see that Kerry was clarifying what Bush claimed was simplistic flip-flopping, and Kerry clarified and defended himself against these falsities without getting heated.

[Thorn]

I wasn't the first to post it, but I thought this would be good in this thread:

Latest polls on who won the debate:

CBS ABC CNN ARG
Kerry 44 45 53 51
Bush 26 36 37 41
Unsure 30 17 10 8

[Bosh]

Interesting Krugman quote.

"These days, Mr. Bush and other administration officials often talk about the 10.5 million Afghans who have registered to vote in this month's election, citing the figure as proof that democracy is making strides after all. They count on the public not to know, and on reporters not to mention, that the number of people registered considerably exceeds all estimates of the eligible population. What they call evidence of democracy on the march is actually evidence of large-scale electoral fraud."

--Krugman

[Imran Siddiqui]

Yeah, I heard as well that 10.5 million is far greater than eligible population .