Iraq is NOT a quagmire!!!

[Arrian]

Please assure me, MrFun, that you haven't completely lost your mind and are advocating we pull out of Iraq so as to prevent more beheadings?

-Arrian

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Arrian
Please assure me, MrFun, that you haven't completely lost your mind and are advocating we pull out of Iraq so as to prevent more beheadings?

-Arrian

We cannot withdraw from Iraq prematurely -- if we do this, then we allow the terrorists to continue using Iraq as a haven.

Before Saddam's overthrow, terrorists did not operate from within Iraq. But ever since our intervention, terrorists have found Iraq to be a new base of operations.

If we withdraw prematurely, we will only be cutting our own throats in fighting terrorism. The incompetence of the Bush administration has created more chaos in parts of Iraq than necessary -- which of course, resulted in higher casualties, and a greater number of hostages.

If Kerry was deciding on our policy towards the new Iraq, would there be no casualties? No -- you would have to be talking out of your ass if everything would fine and hunky-dory because no matter who is in charge, there will be casualties.

But the incompetence, duplicity, and arrogance of the Bush administration has magnified the terrible problems for not only Americans in Iraq, but for Iraqis themselves, who are victims of terrorist attacks.

[Arrian]

Thanks, but a simple "no, I'm not" would've sufficed.

-Arrian

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Arrian
Thanks, but a simple "no, I'm not" would've sufficed.

-Arrian

I don't think I have stated my position in the past, in regards to the new Iraq clearly though, so . . . . . .



tough

[Ogie Oglethorpe]

So your positionis more the incompetence of the handling of Iraq as opposed to the actual expected "All is rosy" spin that is only to be expected in the election year, correct?

[Imran Siddiqui]

Exactly how are we going to withdraw our troops, yet ensure Iraq does not enter in a civil war, and can maintain enough peace to hold elections and maintain the country?

That's actually a pretty damned good question. I don't know the answer to that.. but I don't think Iraq is a quagmire yet. I think it has the potential to be, however.

[GePap]

For the 50th time- the real question in Iraq lies ahead- when the election finally occur and the consitution gets drawn up that dumps the American-enforced one. The level of Federalism in Iraq and issues of representation for the different communities will be the biggest question, and have the biggest potential to sink Iraq into Civil War.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Was he not raised with enough manners to learn how to respectfully disagree with people?

When the people on the other side are actually numbskulls and morons (not that everyone on that side is one of those things), GePap is just calling it like it is .

Or does he use the internet to be a jerk because he knows if he acted that way in real life he would get his face pounded in?

Pot. Kettle. Black. in terms of insults to other posters.

That's an unprovoked ad hominem attack

Technically it isn't. Making a comment on the knowledge of this particular area is not an ad hominem. Ask Agathon, as he has gone over this many times. An ad hominem, stictly speaking, is making a personal attack totally unrelated to the issue at hand, and trying to discredit his views based on the personal attack. Saying you have no knowledge on the subject is quite relevant to the issue at hand.

Besides, this is kids stuff GePap did. Remember when MtG used to get knee deep in the mud in these debates?

[Ogie Oglethorpe]

Originally posted by GePap
For the 50th time- the real question in Iraq lies ahead- when the election finally occur and the consitution gets drawn up that dumps the American-enforced one. The level of Federalism in Iraq and issues of representation for the different communities will be the biggest question, and have the biggest potential to sink Iraq into Civil War.

Agreed by most rational folk. Which is why there is a high degree of antagonism to the sky is falling crowd as the feeling is they only make the situation more untenable.

[GePap]

Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe


Agreed by most rational folk. Which is why there is a high degree of antagonism to the sky is falling crowd as the feeling is they only make the situation more untenable.

If you are saying "the sky is falling!", you usually are tyring to suggest a new course of action to stop that- last time I checked that is a good thing.

[Ogie Oglethorpe]

Cepting that if the feeling is the sky is falling is merely boy crying wolf to gain attention.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Unfortunetly, in this case, it isn't .

[Geronimo]

I wonder if it is too late to improve the cooperation of the Iraqis in rebuilding Iraq and to solicit more help in maintaing peace there by handing control of the occupation over to the UN? Sure, there's no way Bush would ever do that, but maybe Kerry could pursue that route? Or would such a change in policy have little effect by the time Kerry took office?

[Imran Siddiqui]

The problem, Geronimo, is that I believe the first election is supposed to held in January before Kerry would take office. I fear what that election may bring and the hatred right now in Iraq towards Bush may totally FUBAR the rebuilding process. If someone like Al-Sadr wins, there will be huge problems.

[GePap]

Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe
Cepting that if the feeling is the sky is falling is merely boy crying wolf to gain attention.

We scream about the wolves before the invasion- we were right- that others are too self-deluded to realize they are being eaten alive is their problem.