Well that's the end of rap music!

[Natalinasmpf]

guess it makes sense that you would have no sympathy for the artists being ripped off.

Of course, destroy the bourgeois capitalists that try to preen money and oppress the masses!

Azazel - The opiate of the masses

Irony++

[Lonestar]

Originally posted by Albert Speer


All rock is off-key screeching to distorted guitar riffs.

what's your point?

and what's your stereotype of rappers? what's your popular conception? Is it the flava flav-looking, will smith-acting fun hip hopper rhyming all silly and it's fun for the kids? Is it the thug in a hoodie holding a 9mm? Is it the angry black man in military garb hollering fight the power?

how can all rap be the same when there's at least three (fairly negative) stereotypes of how rappers are?

All of the above, I'm fairly open minded.

similiarily, rock has black-wearing hardcore bands with all the loud-ass distorted guitars and screeching about demonic, gothic things; white boy punk bands with all the loud-ass distorted guitars and screeching about how bad conformity is; slow rock bands singing about love and ****.

see, 3 stereotypes too.

Well, I don't really care for quite a few rock bands. (Marilan Manson, etc) and I only like a few Ozzy songs.

[Az]

so what do you like?

[Lonestar]

Benedictine monks chanting.

[Buck Birdseed]

Benedictine monks suck. They all have the same cadences and harmonies. It's all just men bawling. They just copy from each other, there's no progress ever.

[Az]

well, buck, I think that you're being to harsh on non-progressing music. Just because it doesn't constantly progress, doesn't mean it sucks....

[monolith94]

You can always count on apolyton for a debate that reduces everything, whether it be art or economics, to its basest ideas and terms, its most simplistic levels.

My personal favorite cultural sampling comes in "Twelve Monkeys", when Bruce Willis and Madeleine ____ (forget her last name) go to see "Vertigo" in the movie theater. Such a beautiful moment. And certainly creative.

[-Jrabbit]

Originally posted by Natalinasmpf

guess it makes sense that you would have no sympathy for the artists being ripped off.

Of course, destroy the bourgeois capitalists that try to preen money and oppress the masses!

Yeah, I'm sure you'd welcome Robin Hood to take the fruits of your labor without permission, put his name on them and distribute them to all and sundry, making a tidy profit -- not shared with you -- along the way.

[Immortal Wombat]

Well he wouldn't make a tidy profit if everything was stolen from him as well now, would he?

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by Lonestar

All rap is is yakkin' to a beat.

So is poetry.

Try reading pretty much any Shakespearean blank verse, and sooner or later, providing you read a long enough sample, you will find yourself unconsciously slipping into the rhythm of his words.

I possess hardly any rap music- I find gangsta rap completely repellent, but then I'm not a big fan of Whitesnake or Iron Maiden either- both within the umbrella genres of rap and heavy metal you will find trite and sexist depictiosn of women and gratuitously sexist lyrics.

On the other hand I possess quite a lot of Velvet Underground's output, and I don't imagine that a lot of the people deploring rap are actually in favour of songs about going to meet a drug dealer, or how lovely shooting up heroin feels.


In terms of artists 'ripping off' other artists because they are allegedly not creative, then a counter example (other than the obvious ones such as nineteenth century classical composers, T. S. Eliot, John Webster, Picasso, Dali, et cetera) I'd point to D. J. Shadow's 'Endtroducing' album which is a huge collage of samples and sounds which is far greater than the sum of its parts.

Similarly, Colourbox released an album in the 80s which liberally sampled the dialogue from 'The Last Starfighter' to humorous effect.

http://www.sherbornehouse.org.uk/openhouse/pages/all_art_is_theft.html

'All art is theft, they say, but remember, not all theft is art. '

Cinematic theft or, heh heh, 'homage' or 'hommage' It sounds so much more bogus pronounced the French way):

'
A particularly relentless cinematic magpie has been Paul Schrader, perhaps inevitably, since he started as a film critic. His movies are filled with references to his favourite foreign directors. 'The Comfort of Strangers' replicates shot after shot from Alain Resnais's 'Last Year at Marienbad'; Mishima drips with quotes from Japanese cinema, and Patty Hearst with nods to Ozu and Carl Dreyer. Many of them remain grafted on, not fully integrated into Schrader's own directorial tics and tropes, but they do make his movies a very rewarding form of train-spotting for movie snobs.

The worst offenders are those who simply import the patina of Euro-sophistication to enhance their own threadbare intellectual credentials.

There is Brian De Palma, who thinks his dimwitted movies can be enlivened by references to old classics, the worst example being his restaging of Eisenstein's Odessa Steps' sequence in 'The Untouchables'.

Woody Allen springs to mind, with his inexhaustible enthusiasm for the work of Ingmar Bergman. No matter how often Allen tries, nothing of the tortured Scandinavian soul of Bergman registers in his more serious movies, which are po-faced and doom-laden to an almost self-satirising degree.

I would trade every one of Allen's pseudo-Bergmanisms for one viewing of the unbearably grim horror movie 'Last House on the Left', which Wes Craven adapted freely, effectively and without pretension, from Bergman's medieval revenge drama 'Virgin Spring'.

It's nasty, and features chainsaws and castrations, but it's a winning adaptation. '

http://film.guardian.co.uk/features/featurepages/0,4120,894555,00.html

[Agathon]

[quote]both within the umbrella genres of rap and heavy metal you will find trite and sexist depictiosn of women and gratuitously sexist lyrics.[quote]

They've got nothing on my fave metal act, Zodiac Mindwarp and the Love Reaction.

[Az]

I'd point to D. J. Shadow's 'Endtroducing' album which is a huge collage of samples and sounds which is far greater than the sum of its parts.

You know great music too! Oh, molly, is there anything you can't do?!

Agathon:
Btw, speaking of sexism, and objectification of women, I think that my current desktop beats yours ( at least the last one I know of).

[Al B. Sure!]

who the heck is this dj shadow? ive only heard of him on apolyton.

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by Azazel

I'd point to D. J. Shadow's 'Endtroducing' album which is a huge collage of samples and sounds which is far greater than the sum of its parts.

You know great music too! Oh, molly, is there anything you can't do?!

Agathon:
Btw, speaking of sexism, and objectification of women, I think that my current desktop beats yours ( at least the last one I know of).

I'm absolutely hopeless with most mechanical things. I prefer chopsticks to knives and forks.

I can cook, skin and bone and gut animals, birds and fish, deal with unpleasant illnesses, Geneva Convention contravening nappies, insect pests, snakes and scorpions.

But fix something with moving parts and electricity?

Nuh uh.

Alberto Spearcatcher:

D. J. Shadow is Amurrkan:

http://www.djshadow.com/site/index.html

I first found out about him in about 1995-6, I think- I bought a promo tape for 'Endtroducing' which had about 4 or 6 tracks on it, and used to play it on repeat at the gym through my headphones on the step machine.

He's grooovvvyyyyyyy.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B000005DQR/104-4416809-6991132?v=glance

[Agathon]

I have the best rap song in my sig.