Bush bashes Tory leader!

[Dauphin]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
I don't see how that is rewriting anything... but you may... who knows what you see.

Admittedly he was rewriting his position, and his attack was opportunism hidden by faux indignation.

[Atahualpa]

Drake disagrees with me, so I am putting him on ignore

[Imran Siddiqui]

please put me on your ignore list. Please, stop replying to anything I say.

Once again Ned asks someone else to do what he could much easier. Usually it is asking someone to prove a negative, but here asking me to put HIM on my ignore list.

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui

please put me on your ignore list. Please, stop replying to anything I say.

Once again Ned asks someone else to do what he could much easier. Usually it is asking someone to prove a negative, but here asking me to put HIM on my ignore list.

I could never put Ned into the sinbin of the Mollyverse.


The view of history from that through the looking glass place that is the Nedaverse is simply too amusing to ignore.


I am particularly enjoying how he equates the office of the Roman Emperor with the office of the American president (possibly only something that has occurred to Ned and Richard Nixon) and his view on the Barbary Pirates.

Apparently, Europeans had to wait for Jefferson to show them what to do with the pirates, which is kind of interesting, given that France and Great Britain were somewhat preoccupied with the Revolutionary Wars and the Napoleonic Wars.

But it's nice to see that Ned thinks their priorities weren't quite right.

[Ned]

Molly, no doubt you are a good historian and I really enjoy discussing history with you.

Imran, in contrast, is just an ass.

As to Howard position on Iraq, I often watched the debates in Commons and it seemed to me that Howard was supportive of the war at the time. He now says that had he known then what he knows now, his decision would have been different. But it UNFAIR to say that Blair and Bush were wrong at the time based on the information available to them then when even Howard, and for that matter, Kerry voted for war based on that same information.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Imran, in contrast, is just an ass.

I'll take it as a compliment.

Btw, you seem to ignore the major part of the argument, which is par for you, it isn't saying that Bush and Blair were wrong based on the information available... it is saying that they should have done a better job of filtering information and not making it say what they wanted it to say.

Personally I don't think that the WMD was the reason and I don't care if it was. Some do, however, and that's their right.

[MikeH]

If WMD wasn't the reason then our leaders lied to us.

[Imran Siddiqui]

You act like that is a surprising thing .

[Straybow]

If WMD wasn't the reason then our leaders lied to us.

No, it was WMD programs and the intent Saddam to develop and possibly use them, and if you misunderstood that it's your fault.

[Sandman]

Where are the WMD programs then?

[Dauphin]

I've seen a couple on the Discovery channel.

[MrWhereItsAt]

Originally posted by Ned
Besides, Mr.W, these same people (Howard) publicly endorsed Blair's position on Iraq prior to the war, based on the information at hand. Now they, like certain of our Democrats, seek to "rewrite" history for purely "political" reasons. People who do this are not worthy of leadership.

No-one's re-writing history. Sounds like Howard realised his mistake, and it was due to the Governments' misleading of many people with false evidence or at best over-emphasising mistaken evidence that he made a different choice to now. By changing his mind based on available evidence is he thus a legit target? I don't see what relevance this all has to being pre-emptively ostracised by the current US admin, who can't even seem to admit when they were wrong. Which is the greater sign of leadership - refusing to change tunes in the face of nil evidence for your previously stated POV, or being flexible enough to make and change decisions based on what is known at hand?

[Dauphin]

In the Conservative world its far easier to change the past than change your mind.

[Ned]

MrWhere... Howard is entitled to say, had I known now what I knew then, I would have voted differently. But, from my understanding, he is bashing Blair for doing what Howard voted for himself at the time. There is a distinction.

Even Kerry says that his vote for war was a correct decision at the time. He only disagrees with Bush's going to war "without" allies, and you know what that means. He would give Paris a veto.

I assume Howard is saying as much as well. I had no idea the Tories have also surrendered British foreign policy to a French veto.

[Dauphin]

I hope all that spin isn't making you dizzy.