Tax the rich!!!

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by Sava
oooooh yes, let's call it the "death" tax so people think it's bad...

This from mr. "they aren't pro-life, they're anti-choice!"?

I see your s, and raise you a dozen more.

[Geronimo]

Originally posted by Kuciwalker

Originally posted by Geronimo
But the lazy leaching off the hard working is exactly what wealth inheritance is all about!

If I decide to use my money to support someone, what's it to you? It's my money.

Anyway, another consequence of your argument (unintended, I'm sure) is that charities would have to be taxed heavily too - I mean, it's the same thing! They're getting money without working for it!

I have never respected the rights of the dead to own property. When I'm dead I think I will no longer be entitled to claim ownership of anything. So yeah, I agree your money (if you earned it) is your money exclusively in a very profoundly sacred sense. But when you're dead it won't be your money anymore and even if it was you are giving it away to someone else so it still will no longer be your money. So why shouldn't I want that money (which no longer belongs to the person who earned it) to get hit with the tax stick instead of the money that I and other productive people earned?

I'd hit charities with the tax stick too except every cent given to charity can be another cent that the government doesn't try to take from Earners to fill some politically volitile perceived "need".

So no taxes on charities simply because that would probably produce more irrational demand for government services. yuck.

[Kuciwalker]

I have never respected the rights of the dead to own property. When I'm dead I think I will no longer be entitled to claim ownership of anything. So yeah, I agree your money (if you earned it) is your money exclusively in a very profoundly sacred sense. But when you're dead it won't be your money anymore and even if it was you are giving it away to someone else so it still will no longer be your money.

Why can't I decide what will be done with my money after I die?

I'd hit charities with the tax stick too except every cent given to charity can be another cent that the government doesn't try to take from Earners to fill some politically volitile perceived "need".

So no taxes on charities simply because that would probably produce more irrational demand for government services. yuck.

So what if there's that demand? According to you, such programs shouldn't exist in the first place - after all, welfare is by definition giving money to people who don't work!

[MRT144]

ok.

dino doc. i believe taxing the rich more can add needed money to the government to fund socially responsible programs.

berzeker, next time you put words in my mouth make sure they dont come out of your ass

[Japher]

apher please explain why and how it matters how many times my money is taxed.

Geronimo!

It is definitly important why and how taxes are levied, very important. However, inheritence tax/death tax I am truly fine with, it's only when people try to ruin that they shouldn't be able to get away with it. For every law their will be away around it.

Is it fair? Hell ya! Those who know how to handle money tend to earn more of it, tend to educate their kids how to handle it, and tend to avoid more taxes.

Is it wrong? Hell no! Money matters are not something taught in school, they are learned through live, ambition, and hard work. If I think that someone is entitled to keeping what they work for than that's my deal. It is also my motivation that hard work pays off. If you are willing to work your ass off only to give it all away than that is your deal.

Most ppl work so that their kids can have a better life than them, and if they die before they can give it to them should they be taxed for it?

Taxes are everywhere. I admire Ted Turner for giving money to the government as charity donation. I admire Ted Turner (sorry to pick on him) for generating a company and an industry that has given so many jobs and incomes that the government can continue to tax for whatever they want to do. It is that kind of career creation and tax creation that makes this country rich, and is why there are tax breaks for those who do such; the returns come 10 fold for such people... and you are going to complain over inheritence.

[Berzerker]

But the lazy leaching off the hard working is exactly what wealth inheritance is all about!

Incorrect, leeches are parasites that take without consent. Parents giving their children money is consensual... They want a better life for their children so they help them. It's their money, not yours. The leeches are the liberals who think they are entitled to other people's money and take it by force, without consent. Besides, damn near every child of a future millionaire works for a living long before they inherit money. You guys may find it convenient to condemn inheritance by focusing on the small minority who sit back and inherit a million without ever really working themselves, but that is a stereotype people into class warfare use to distort reality.

Which misses the point that the factors that make one rich are very likely at least in part genetic (as well as "inherited" through family values/methods of upbringing that continue from generation to generation in a family), so the number is really meaningless - how many of these people would have become rich on their own? It could be a significant number.

Uh oh, let's steal their genes for re-distribution and then we can steal their parents to raise other people's children.

Because it's his work

And he can do what he wants with the results. The irony here is while you guys condemn inheritance because it's one person acquiring money from the labor of another (the fact it's consensual is lost on y'all), you guys want to acquire money from other people's labor too (but without consent). Funny you'd look down your nose at people who inherit...

oooooh yes, let's call it the "death" tax so people think it's bad...

It is bad, and it is a death tax. People pay taxes on their income, and then that income is taxed again when they die, because they die. If they didn't die, the tax wouldn't exist. Of course, I'm sure liberals would demand we tax people for living too long.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Berzerker
And he can do what he wants with the results.

That's exactly what he wants to do.

[Berzerker]

I admire Ted Turner for giving money to the government as charity donation. I admire Ted Turner (sorry to pick on him) for generating a company and an industry that has given so many jobs and incomes that the government can continue to tax for whatever they want to do.

I admire him for the latter, not the former. The money he gave the UN and government, probably a bribe anyway, gets wasted by corrupt people, The money he uses to create jobs creates wealth for himself and others.

berzeker, next time you put words in my mouth make sure they dont come out of your ass

You're right, why take what is clean and make it dirty? Go right ahead and explain why my characterisation is invalid. Otherwise, don't complain.

[Geronimo]

Originally posted by Kuciwalker

I have never respected the rights of the dead to own property. When I'm dead I think I will no longer be entitled to claim ownership of anything. So yeah, I agree your money (if you earned it) is your money exclusively in a very profoundly sacred sense. But when you're dead it won't be your money anymore and even if it was you are giving it away to someone else so it still will no longer be your money.

Why can't I decide what will be done with my money after I die?

Sure decide what you want. But do not expect me to ascribe to your post mortem transactions the same validity that I give to your ownership of the money you earn. It's critical that we control the fruits of our own labors but it's of no consequence that other people get to keep the fruits of our labors after we leave the world. My objection to taking someone's earned money is that it is tantamount to slavery. Can't enslave someone who is dead. only the living.

Originally posted by Kuciwalker

I'd hit charities with the tax stick too except every cent given to charity can be another cent that the government doesn't try to take from Earners to fill some politically volitile perceived "need".

So no taxes on charities simply because that would probably produce more irrational demand for government services. yuck.

So what if there's that demand? According to you, such programs shouldn't exist in the first place - after all, welfare is by definition giving money to people who don't work!

Because I'm enough of a pragmatist to realize that if charities are discouraged it will be that much harder to protect the integrity of earned property from the grubby hands of the government. Throughout history governments have always viewed bread riots as a dangerous thing to be avoided at any cost, especially when that cost can be planted on the shoulders of the earners.

[Berzerker]

That's exactly what he wants to do.

But liberals won't let him, they want the accumulated fruits of his labor.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Berzerker


But liberals won't let him, they want the accumulated fruits of his labor.

And conservatives want to take a little at a time, everytime he decides to work or buy something.

[MRT144]

as for the inheritance or estate tax, (death tax is silly because its not like the person is taxed when he dies. Imagine the scene: "well willy just kicked off, thatll be 1000 dollars. Oh he died of a gunshot wound...very sorry, its now 10000." It really is a tax on what you inherit and pass along. dolts.) im against it. what you do with your money after youre is your business. however, while youre alive, you i believe that a part of your income needs to go programs that benefit a large group of people.

forced alrtuism is far from the worst thing in the world.

[MRT144]

Originally posted by Berzerker
You're right, why take what is clean and make it dirty? Go right ahead and explain why my characterisation is invalid. Otherwise, don't complain.

because it is a characterization, and by that very fact is not factual or a true indication of who i am. it is an overstatement in an attempt to brand me as something.i am not a liberal. I have certain opinions that lean left, and certain that lean right. get used to it.

[Velociryx]

Absolutely right, there are only 30k people in the USA with a net worth of 30Mil +, which slants the numbers even more favorably in my favor. Thanks for catching that!

Further:

A 2002 study by Capgemini found that more than half of the high-net-worth individuals in the U.S. were "new money," or self-made millionaires. Inherited money is declining as a share of wealth in the U.S., according to the study, accounting for less than 20% of high-net-worth individuals in 2002.

taken from:

http://www.globalpolicy.org/socecon/inequal/2004/0615millionaires.htm

More? I'm beginning to enjoy this!

-=Vel=-

[Velociryx]

Remember now, the original hypothesis was that it's easier BY FAR to inherit wealth enough to make one "rich" than it is to go out and bootstrap.

We've already agreed here that a cool mil = "rich" so these numbers don't jive with what you're saying.

-=Vel=-