So, have YOU seen "Fahrenheit 9/11"?

[Verto]

The link requires registration.

[sprucemoose3311]

i will only f911 is one of my friends downloads it, i wont pay to see it

[chequita guevara]

Why don't you quote the relevent part, DD. I don't feel like registering to a site I'm only going to look at once.

[DinoDoc]

Kennedy comments cut in Moore movie as in trailer

Associated Press


U.S. Rep. Mark Kennedy didn't get his say in the trailer for the Michael Moore's controversial new movie and he won't get it in "Fahrenheit 9/11" when the full-length feature hits theaters this summer.

Last week, when the movie trailer first appeared on the Internet, it contained Moore's ambush interview of the Watertown Republican. In the preview, the liberal film maker asks Kennedy to help enlist the children of members of congress to fight in Iraq.

Kennedy's reply is not given in the trailer, which annoyed the congressman, because Kennedy said that he had talked about his nephews in the military and fighting overseas. He has two nephews who have served.

On Friday, Moore issued a statement saying none of the exchange between Moore and Kennedy is included in the film. "No statements by Rep. Kennedy are in the film," he statement said. "There was no editing of his remarks."

Joanne Doroshow, a spokeswoman for Moore's office, said Tuesday that Kennedy appears in the movie as he does in the trailer: for only a few seconds and he doesn't speak.

Kennedy's spokeswoman, Anne Mason, took issue with the "no editing" line.

"His remarks were still edited," she said Tuesday. "They were edited quite a bit - completely out."

[chequita guevara]

I guess I would be upset if I were the Congressman. The expression on Kennedy's face though was hysterical.

It is, however, a minor nitpick, given that the main point Moore was making, only one Congressman has any kids in Iraq, still stands.

[DinoDoc]

And then we have the outright exaggerations or lies: http://www.usatoday.com/usatonline/2...5/6319021s.htm

[Whaleboy]

Originally posted by Agathon


You find me someone else who comes up with such sigworthy material.

Touché!!

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
I guess I would be upset if I were the Congressman. The expression on Kennedy's face though was hysterical.

I imagine it was creative editing allows for interesting things.

[chequita guevara]

In some scenes, '9/11' omits the finer points

By Mark Memmott
USA TODAY

Fahrenheit 9/11 is not intended to be objective; director Michael Moore concedes that point. But he also has said he is ''presenting the truth.'' A look at some of the movie's controversial points:

* President Bush's reaction to news of the Sept. 11 attacks

Moore uses video of the president as Bush learned that a second jet had hit the World Trade Center the morning of Sept. 11, 2001. The president was in a classroom in Sarasota, Fla., listening to second-graders read.

Bush sat in the classroom for seven minutes after learning of the news from his chief of staff, Andrew Card. Moore superimposes a timer on the screen to document the passage of time, then asks what was going through the president's mind. Was he, Moore wonders, regretting spending 42% of his first eight months in office on ''vacation?''

Moore bases his quip on an Aug. 6, 2001, story in the Washington Post that said by the end of that month Bush would have spent 42% of his first seven months in office ''at vacation spots or en route.'' The calculation included weekends spent at the presidential retreat in Camp David, Md., and a month-long ''working vacation'' at the president's ranch in Crawford, Texas. Moore doesn't say that the ''vacation'' days included weekends or that Bush worked part of most of those days. He met, for example, with British Prime Minister Tony Blair.

You don't do as much when you're away from the office, even on a working vacation.

The other message Moore sends is that Bush was frozen, unable to do anything until he was told what to do by his aides. The independent 9/11 commission reported that Bush told its members he felt it was important to remain calm when not much was known about the attacks.

That was a bad call on their part then. It showed poorly on the President then and now. The last thing he should have done when he learned that the U.S. was under attack is sit around in a class room full of children. He should have excused himself and moved to a secure location. For all he knew, terrorists were targetting him as well. As inept a president as he has been, having him killed on 9/11 would have been very bad for the country. Furthermore, a swifter response might have saved the lives of those killed in the attack on the Pentagon.

* The decision to let some Saudis leave the USA shortly after 9/11 and alleged connections among the Bush family, Saudi royalty and Osama bin Laden's family

Moore questions why the Bush administration allowed 142 Saudis, including members of bin Laden's family, to fly out of the USA Sept. 14 through Sept. 24, 2001. He suggests that business ties between oil-rich Saudi Arabia and the Bush family might have resulted in special treatment for some Saudi citizens -- even though 15 of the 19 terrorists who hijacked planes on 9/11 were Saudis.

The implication: Saudis who might have had information about the attacks -- or even been involved -- slipped through the president's fingers.

But the movie does not point out that the FBI interviewed about 30 of the Saudis before they left the USA and that investigators say no one on board the planes has turned out to be of interest. The independent 9/11 commission has reported that ''each of the flights we have studied was investigated by the FBI and dealt with in a professional manner prior to its departure.''

They were minimal interviews. The FBI has since stated it would have liked to have done more thorough interviews.

* An alleged connection between Bush and the Taliban that ruled Afghanistan

The link is not made with Bush, but with Ken Lay (the biggest contributor to Bush) and with Unical. Then point is then made that two Unical consultants then became President of Afganistan and U.S. Envoy to Afganistan.

Saying that the Clinton Administration was aware of and allowed the Taliban access to the U.S. is meaningless in this context. The fact that Clinton was a whore to business doesn't mean Bush isn't also a whore to business.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by DinoDoc
I imagine it was creative editing allows for interesting things.

No, he just stopped the Congressman and told him what he was up to. Kennedy then looked at Moore as if he had told him that his face was made of ham. The previous Congressman told Moore he thought it was a good idea. Other congressman ran from Moore.

[GePap]

Having just seen the movie in a packed house, I find that USA Today and all the other counterclaims pretty weak and pathetic.

Did I like the movie? Did I find it powerful? Not much. I find the links he tries to make facile and old-old as in yes, I have seen these links made over and over, and yet I know the truth not to be so simplistic, so no, I don't think it very powerful. NO, this war was not about money or oil, and neither was afghanistan.

MOst of the stuff seen was not new to me- a few things were: this is the only movie out there that shows footage form Iraq as raw as what we saw from Vietnam-no where else do you really see the counsequences of the war besides a few short second after any attack- youo certainly don;t see the amputees or injured soldiers. The video of the public beheading in SA was shocking, though it isn't too graphic. Interestingly, what he shows right at the start about the eletion of 2000, like the vehemence of the protests as Bush was inagurated was new to me-I had never seen that the president's limo was pelted with eggs that day.

Certainly he uses editing to its fullest, and he does make members of the admin. look like fools, which is no shock as many of them are. None of his sequences with the Saudis did much for me- of course anyone heavily invested in the oil industry will be in bed with the Saudis. The Grath revelation was interesting thought.

Maybe I am too cynical, maybe I am too tired of the same old juvenile anti-war arguements that miss the real and important anti-war arguements, the powerful, valid ones, not the facile easy to make but lacking evidence ones to look too deeply into his treatment of the war- but only one thing in the movie had real power for me, Mrs. Lipscomb. Her story, and what she goes through, and specially what happens in DC and the encouter with the pro-Bush woman-that was what hit me. Because for me, that is the great sin of Bush and this war: he used people like her, their patriotism, their faith and trust in our government, and manipulated them into thinking a war of choice was a war of necessity. And it scikens me to this day that some people are still trying to sell me this war as a war of necessity, and that so much of the public is either still fooled, or unwilling to look.

[DinoDoc]

[QUOTE] Originally posted by chegitz guevara
You don't do as much when you're away from the office, even on a working vacation.[/q]Sure. Whatever. Like I said exaggeration.

Furthermore, a swifter response might have saved the lives of those killed in the attack on the Pentagon.

A quicker reponse from the President would have done jack in that regard. The FAA was the weak link in that regard. Again an exaggeration at best, an out right lie at worst.

They were minimal interviews.

... investigators say no one on board the planes has turned out to be of interest. The independent 9/11 commission has reported that ''each of the flights we have studied was investigated by the FBI and dealt with in a professional manner prior to its departure.''

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by DinoDoc
[q]Kennedy comments cut in Moore movie as in trailer

They should be glad, because Kennedy claims in his comments something that isn't true, that he has two nephews in Iraq. He has only one nephew in the active armed services, and he isn't stationed in Iraq.

Moore also pointed out that Kennedy, in his remarks, promised to help Moore recruit the sons and daughters of U.S. Congresspersons to the military for service in Iraq. As of now, Kennedy has not seemed fit to follow through on that promise.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov
They should be glad,

Don't care. It's emblematic of a man who sees nothing wrong with playing fast and loose with the facts especially given his poor record with the truth in the past.

[GePap]

Originally posted by DinoDoc
Don't care. It's emblematic of a man who sees nothing wrong with playing fast and loose with the facts especially given his poor record with the truth in the past.

Yeah, the Bush character is no good, is he?