Why isn't this piracy?

[Sirotnikov]

Personally, I go by the belief that if it isn't broken, you shouldn't fix it, 'cause we just end up ****ing around untill there really is a problem.

I can just imagine you sitting there, all curled up, fearing the worse - - GM Beans From Outer Space!!!

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Q Cubed
except this is a silly argument, imho. the problem here isn't the gm food. the problem is the fact that the system as it stands allows something that could be considered by its very existence "open source" (anybody can modify it, everybody has a copy of it...) is being forced into a patent regime where specific people control it.

why shun a technological advance because of a stupid social system?

gm foods are not the evil. it's the fact that megacorps can patent something that you shouldn't be able to patent.

But the more fundamental question is "Why do we need GM food?"

As I point out before, there's no food shortage globally. It's the distributioin that's the problem.

So, GM food is just a solution looking for a problem. The only reason for it is large biotech companies are pushing GM food, with the aim of monopolising the seed supplies.

[Q Classic]

what about the question: "why don't we need gm food?"

it's a shame if we don't allow scientific progress because we're too short-sighted to see an immediate need for it now. the technologies developed now in making gm foods will go a long way towards our understandingn of genetics.

[Ben Kenobi]

As I point out before, there's no food shortage globally. It's the distributioin that's the problem.

So, GM food is just a solution looking for a problem. The only reason for it is large biotech companies are pushing GM food, with the aim of monopolising the seed supplies.

Increased yields wouldn't be another motivation?

[Chemical Ollie]

Originally posted by GePap
We can feed the whole world today without GM crops.

Though I am not opposed to them, they aren't necessary.

With GM crops and other biotech inventions, I heard some estimation that the globe could feed up to 50 billion people.

But hey, why are we discussing GM crops at all? That's exactly what the pirates wanted, right? Don't give in to terrorism!

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Q Cubed
what about the question: "why don't we need gm food?"

Is this question in the same category as "why don't you need another hole in your head?"

The problem with GM food right now is the same problem we have been facing for many decades: namely we rush to use a new product or technology before we even know how it impacts on the environment and everything else. You know, things like DDT and CFC. The list just keeps going on, and we haven't learned a damned thing from our mistakes.

Originally posted by Q Cubed
it's a shame if we don't allow scientific progress because we're too short-sighted to see an immediate need for it now. the technologies developed now in making gm foods will go a long way towards our understandingn of genetics.

You are confused. Science and technology are two different beasts. Even without GM food, we can still acquire new knowledge in genetics. In fact, GM is but an application of genetics, which we can do without, at least for food.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
Increased yields wouldn't be another motivation?

There are other ways to increase yield, and other things can be done. For example, if cattle aren't fed and is strictly regulated to grazing on grass only, that would save a lot of food.

[David Floyd]

Hehehe, I'd like to see Greenpeace try this at a Texas port - or for that matter, ANY US port. God that'd be some great TV, if they televised the forthcoming beatdown

[Patroklos]

It came anywhere near any us warship (or any US ship in the vicinity of one) they would be smoked at 300 yards. Like it has been said, this would be a great terrorist tactic, to just imitate the Green "Peace" movement.

And about this whole raising the issue "even if people don't want to hear it," I am all about letting you say yout peice, but when it is obvious to all they everyone has heard, thought about, and rejected you stupid ideas give it a rest.

[Q Classic]

The problem with GM food right now is the same problem we have been facing for many decades: namely we rush to use a new product or technology before we even know how it impacts on the environment and everything else. You know, things like DDT and CFC. The list just keeps going on, and we haven't learned a damned thing from our mistakes.

granted, it's a problem. we're still here, aren't we? no matter how much rigorous testing something goes through, you'll still have unintended consequences. you can't keep science locked up in a lab somewhere; if you publish any scientific work, somebody else will take it, and whether you like it or not, they might just release it to the world.

You are confused. Science and technology are two different beasts. Even without GM food, we can still acquire new knowledge in genetics. In fact, GM is but an application of genetics, which we can do without, at least for food.

that's like saying even without stem cell research, we can still acquire new knowledge in genetics and human biology.

sure, we can, but why shun a potential avenue of research just because you're squeamish about its possibilities?

[child of Thor]

my irrational fear of GM is about as well founded as most of the 'love GM' brigade here

It could be about a lack of respect for nature? but i smell a lot of 'right winger' wafting from my screen, so that leads me to believe its probably just a lack of respect for most things.

Just because i think its a good idea to be cautious about the way we treat our planet and its very complex enviromental systems - doesn't make me anti science or progress(in fact my old man is a world leading agri-scientist(now retired)), so i've seen first hand the mistakes we have made in our arrogance(DDT, Airial crop spraying of nasty chamicals, Cane toad introduction in Australia etc etc), and the success.

We constantly have dropped the ball with devestating consequences. So when a technology comes along that we know too little about i think it prudent to seek a slower introduction + further tests, especialy when the need for the technology is debatable in the first place and the odd blunder has already caused enough damage. Just seems a reasonable approach to me?

And IMO Pirates still rule when they stop GM entering my country

[Q Classic]

do i count as a right-winger now?

trust me, i can see what rampant development can do to a country--there are places in korea where you wouldn't want to swim, even now after a fledgeling green movement has started.

but see, what you were saying wasn't slowing introduction or adding further tests--how it came across was that you didn't want it in the first place. that's what i took issue with. nowhere in your previous posts do you mention having more tests instead of a breakneck release pace; you said you would fight tooth and nail to see that it is never introduced.

are you changing your position now? because this new position of yours, or at least, what seems like a new position, i don't mind so much, and can agree with. retarding the rate of research isn't the best of all outcomes, but it's better than the no research you seemed to be suggesting.

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat
It's not a question of "anyone who someone was annoyed by"

It's a question of "people who are so far out on the fringe, and so stridently, hysterically vocal compared to the rest of us, that they undermine the movement and alienate a large number of potential supporters."

It's a question of ditching the Fezzes of reality

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by Urban Ranger
But the more fundamental question is "Why do we need GM food?"

Because it makes growing food cheaper?

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by Patroklos
And about this whole raising the issue "even if people don't want to hear it," I am all about letting you say yout peice, but when it is obvious to all they everyone has heard, thought about, and rejected you stupid ideas give it a rest.

That argument doesn't work on these boards. Why do you think we have so many commies?