Rugby - Truck and Trailer!

[Caligastia]

Why isn't Mehrtens even on the bench for this game against England? Is Graham Henry getting over-optimistic? Not that Carlos is useless or anything, but Mehrtens seems to be playing better than ever.




Old Thread

[Tamerlin]

Sorry guys, no time to catch up with the thread today, I will try to find some time to read Andydog's and Havak's posts tomorrow.

We will soon learn if the Kiwis have managed to find some true forwards.

[finbar]

Back from Paris and the re-burial of the bloody little grenouille prince's heart?

Bledisloe? tests?

When did they receive that elevated status? I always thought they were now friendly little games of S12 writ large? I had no idea they gave you guys CAPS for them still - what is the world coming to?

Oh dear, the paroxysms of fear over the forthcoming thumpings have cut off the oxygen supply to the brain.

EDIT. I know none of us like to be reminded of the valuable time we waste solving the problems of the world in our threads, but, since we started these dedicated rugby threads, and up to and including the last post in the just-closed "Swinging Handbags" thread, we have totted up

9, 851

posts.

That amounts to a couple of weeks out of your lives! You should all be thoroughly ashamed of yourselves!

[finbar]

Re: Rugby - Truck and Trailer!

Originally posted by Caligastia
Why isn't Mehrtens even on the bench for this game against England? Is Graham Henry getting over-optimistic? Not that Carlos is useless or anything, but Mehrtens seems to be playing better than ever.

Who knows? Unfortunately, England isn't going to be a true test of Carlos' redemption. The first Bledisloe will sort things out.

[Havak]

There is Oxygen missing from a brain - but are you sure it's mine?

Carlos is going to get much more time and space against the Wallaby pack surely? You never did respond to Eddie having to pick a one season greenhorn prop for the squad this year? Then there's his desperate efforts to draft a Fijian (Newcastle are still reporting they expect him to turn up for pre-season in July - which is interesting?)

[finbar]

Originally posted by Havak
There is Oxygen missing from a brain - but are you sure it's mine?

Can't be mine. I don't have one.

Carlos is going to get much more time and space against the Wallaby pack surely?

He didn't in the World Cup, did he.

You never did respond to Eddie having to pick a one season greenhorn prop for the squad this year?

Why should this season be different?

Then there's his desperate efforts to draft a Fijian (Newcastle are still reporting they expect him to turn up for pre-season in July - which is interesting?)

Oh well, Clive drafted an Australian.

[The Mad Monk]

I love my truck, but I don't own a trailer.

[Havak]

He didn't in the World Cup, did he.

Yes those three games last year were interesting I agree. That impressive AB display in Australia – the muted reply in NZ when your pack started to get in their faces and that semi-final of course – where your forwards got under their skin and starved them of time and space and they had no answer. Couple this with the way they failed to score against 13 men for ten minutes last June and you wonder why Andydog is always so defensive of an area (the forwards) where they clearly have problems.

They cannot afford to let you use the same gameplan. Saturday will tell us what the new look kiwi pack is capable of. Dig at England all you like – it is still a formidable pack we are fielding in terms of sheer power. Meeuws is huge and rated the best Kiwi prop of his generation – and yet White will deliver a scrummaging lesson to him Saturday.

Why should this season be different?

Well there is that.

Oh well, Clive drafted an Australian.

God only knows why – there are plenty of good young flankers who are truly English. He should have taken Will Skinner. Then again at least he isn’t actually playing the Aussie tourist now is he?

Just to re-iterate I expect us to lose Saturdays game because of the difference in the backs – with an honourary mention for Hilly being out of position. We will win the forward battle and will probably therefore have the large majority of possession. The trouble with the ABs is they probably won’t need much ball to score with. Much as I criticise lardy thommo he is more than a match for his opposite number who clearly wished he was a flanker instead – he crops up everywhere on the field but lacks at the core work of a hooker for me. And Rush against Dally – nose is over the hill all right but Rush is quite untested against such experience – lets not confuse the fact he was groomed to take over from Zinzan at the franchise to mean he is as good yet? No arguments with McCaw – he is good (clearly modelling his game on Backy). Jack needs a huge season though if he is to fulfil the potential he clearly has.

Is the wind up pot stirring nicely now? Will Andydog make another appearance to refute my “wild accusations”?

[finbar]

Originally posted by Havak
God only knows why – there are plenty of good young flankers who are truly English. He should have taken Will Skinner. Then again at least he isn’t actually playing the Aussie tourist now is he?

No, and the boy's had a free business-class trip to see his family. Very generous of Clive.

Is the wind up pot stirring nicely now? Will Andydog make another appearance to refute my “wild accusations”?

Well, if you can't get a bite out of him after that lot, mention the NZ s***** team's recent 2 - 4 loss to Vanuatu - Vanuatu!?!, you yelp - and see what happens.

Just finished watching the last ep of "Angels In America". Extraordinary television. Up itself at times, but some staggering performances and a very potent message. Gather it bombed over there. It was put up against that celebrity "Get me out of here" series, whatever it's called.

[Andydog]

Is the wind up pot stirring nicely now? Will Andydog make another appearance to refute my "wild accusations"?

I refute these wild accusations!

We will win the forward battle and will probably therefore have the large majority of possession.

Here’s my take on it:

Woodman v Meeuws, Meeuws more powerful, Woodman faster.
Thompson v Mealamu, Thompson more powerful, Mealamu a little faster
White v Hayman, I’m not sure about these two

Shaw v Jack, Shaw better
Grewcock v Robinson, Grewcock better

Worsley v Gibbes, even
Dallaglio v Rush - Dallaglio better
Hill v McCaw - McCaw better

I would expect our lineout to be better. Also, note that Henry hasn't chosen eight individuals as forwards (as Mitchell did). He's chosen a PACK, and a hungry, balanced and potentially cohesive one at that - with 3 S12 captains - no excuses for non-leadership there methinks.

We have damaging ball carriers in Meuws and Meleamu. We have class in Jack and McCaw. We have Hayman adding grunt to the scrum, Robinson providing lift to the lineout, Rush and Gibbes adding muscle and passion to the breakdown. And best of all – we have the house-of-pain home advantage!

I think that’s a good enough stir of the winding up pot.

As we all agree, Saturday will tell us what the new look AB pack are capable of. But I think that our forwards will do enough to secure platform for a backline with more explosive power, speed and skill than any in the world.

Bring on the World Champions!

[Havak]

I have never heard of that series Finbar – but that Celebrity jungle nonsense beat everything in the ratings sadly. I think I accidentally caught five seconds of it myself.

I actually agree with large parts of your thinking there Andydog, much as that may surprise you. Certainly as a number 7 I would take McCaw over Hill anyday for Tigers.

But I spotted something this affo that makes me want to stir the wind up pot a little more.

Now you might be thinking Vanuatu?

But I actually prefer this one.

Graham Henry quoted by the BBC today:

“Super 12 is played in summer on hard grounds and it becomes a glorified game of sevens. But when you play in Dunedin in June it's not those conditions, it is a totally different ball game. You can't play that style in international rugby. There has been a drift away from setting the forward platform to play the game, and there has to be a drift back to that if the All Blacks want to be major contenders in the future.”

“We have concentrated on the Jonah Lomu's, the Jeff Wilson's and the Tana Umaga's to do something brilliant to win a game of rugby. We haven't concentrated enough on the efficiency of unit play and individuals to produce a top team.”

"I think that we need to work very closely with the Super 12 coaches and share ideas and expertise. We need to do that so we are all working to the same ends, and maybe giving away a bit of the sevens style of rugby to concentrate on making sure that we've got the basics right.”

“We've got a respect for rugby in Europe, and in particular, a respect for rugby in England. The foundations of the game are particularly strong in the Premiership. It's a huge battle every week in most games, which provides a marvellous foundation for the international team. There is a real good work ethic there, and a professionalism in the game. The quality of the game they are trying to produce - unit skills and individual skills - has a major emphasis, which there hasn't been here”
A good stir this one?

[finbar]

Originally posted by Havak
I have never heard of that series Finbar – but that Celebrity jungle nonsense beat everything in the ratings sadly. I think I accidentally caught five seconds of it myself.

"Angels In America" is a six-hour HBO miniseries based on Tony Kushner's epic play, adapted by him, directed by Mike Nichols. Set in 1985, when AIDS first started to make its mark, it's a massive metaphorical critique of America in the 1980s and Reganism in particular. It will be repeated at some stage.

A good stir this one?

I imagine G. Henry is claiming it as original thought, too.

EDIT. Predictable Wallaby lineup announced to face Scotland. Wendell retains his spot only as a result of the Mortlock/Flatley injury reshuffle. Phil Waugh is stiff, but, again, he lost out in the shuffle to introduce a flanker/lineout jumper. I wouldn't want to be in his way when he runs on as a replacement. Apart from Wendell, David Lyons is perhaps the luckiest inclusion. Queensland's John Roe had a much better S12 season.

[Havak]

I would think that series is unlikely to be re-aired just at the moment with everyone suddenly looking back at Reaganism through rose tinted glasses.

Fingers crossed that tomorrow brings NZ their fourth loss at Dunedin in 101 years.

You know Wendell could do very well against Scotland – I am not sure they are equipped to deal with a powerful direct runner in their defence. Good to see Tuqiri has not done an Iestyn Harris as well?

So Pug face Waughy is shining pine? Not sure Scotland deserve what they will get when he comes on really?

I had Lyons pegged as a fixture so interesting to see you saying he may not be the form player.

The England A side picked for the Canada game on Sunday is actually quite interesting – the second row consists of Alex Brown from Glaws and Jonno’s protégé Louis Deacon. There is a very real chance over the next few years this will become the senior sides second row combination so it will be good to see how they go.

The bench is also of note as Tigers hooker George Chuter takes his first step towards international rugger. There is also a familiar name on that bench – Johnson. This is Will Johnson, younger brother of Martin. A solid club player he has always just missed out on international recognition (probably as he played blindside mainly until last season and we have them in spades). Since then he has started to play 8 instead and is probably the primary reason Balding was shipped to Gloucester amnd why Will has now got his chance to wear the rose. I wish him well in taking his chance if he gets it. We need a Johnson in an England shirt after all – if only for annoyance value to you Finbar.

[Andydog]

A good stir this one?

not bad, not bad at all. I had seen that actually, and to be honest, I have to agree with Henry on this, as shocking as that may seem. Although I think the term "glorified sevens" is a little extreme - the crusaders have won it for years playing a forwards based percentages game after all.

But here is something that has made my farking day! (link)

New Zealand coach Graham Henry says the All Blacks will put the boot into England in their quest to get quick ball, if the occasion calls for it on Saturday night.

Last year, the All Blacks ex-coach John Mitchell banned his players from rucking at the World Cup, because he thought the chance of giving away penalties was too high, but Henry told ONE Sport that no such ban has been put in place this year.

And with England's reputation for slowing down ball at the break down, New Zealand's loose forwards may well need to stamp their authority at rucks - figuratively speaking, of course - in the first test at Dunedin.

"If rucking is required, there'll be rucking," Henry said. "We haven't put a black line through the word ruck. If the occasion arises, in the modern game there are a lot of mini rucks and mini mauls and I guess both teams will be looking to get quick ball.

"But occasionally they'll be bodies in the way and we'll have to drive over and make sure the ball's available.

"We'll be talking about those sorts of things; we're looking for a good platform to play an attractive game so we'll be looking for quick ball at the tackle situation."

Whaa hoo! The best news I've had all week. Sharpen those sprigs and get going boys! Giddy up!

[Havak]

"England's reputation for killing ball"? Have you Kiwis even watched your own team lately?

As for the prospect of NZ rucking that does bother me - your guys seem to think it requires standing on opposition heads IIRC.