O'Reilly Rips Coulter

[Drake Tungsten]

Baltimore?! You can have it...

[Q Classic]

'racially charged?'

yes. as in there's a very clear reference to race there, one that is very likely to polarize people's stance on the issue.

No, and I don't believe Coulter is saying this. I do agree that the tragedy of the relocation of Japanese Canadians and Americans has been blown out of proportion. It's still a tragedy, but in light of the Nanking Massacre, can hardly be compared.

that's not what i'm saying.
in fact, it's not even close.
what i'm saying is that coulter is wrong to link an american to the atrocities committed by the japanese.
so he happens to be japanese in ethnicity. he was born american, he suffered as a japanese american, and now serves as an american. he has virtually no links to crimes perpetrated by the japanese other than his ethnicity, and rather than perpetrating those crimes because of his origin, he suffered because of them.
should i link vonnegut or einstein to the holocaust because they've got german blood? why should mineta be linked to the bataan death march because he's got japanese blood?
and hell, why even bring up the nanking massacre? is the evil of the internment necessarily less so because the japanese--not the japanese americans--committed something worse? it still doesn't change the fact that the most slanderous comment she makes against mineta is linking him to yet another atrocity committed by people who really only share the same skin color, facial shape, and a smidgen of cultural heritage.

I don't think it should matter one bit, your ethnicity. I'm supporting one of you mongoloids in the Conservative party in my riding, whom I think is a fine candidate.
I live in Hongcouver, for pete's sake. We're a minority in some of the suburbs.
I've even dated a Korean for a short while. If you don't believe it, you can prolly find quotes in the OT Archive when I first started posting in OT.

i think it does matter, my ethnicity, in this case. i'm an american, but i'm not willing to pretend that i haven't got asian origins. because of that, i find it quite offensive that when people with similar ethnic origins are smeared and stereotyped because of those origins. i don't care that you've dated an asian, nor am i saying that all rightists are necessarily racially motivated. i don't care if you're supporting a conservative asian canadian, because what matters in that case is that he's canadian, not that he's asian. it doesn't matter one whit because you're not the one who would be branded as a foreigner based on your looks.
the problem with coulter's column in this case is precisely that she makes such a big deal about his ethnicity. she makes it an integral part of the piece. if you took out all references to mineta's "japanese-ness", you would end up with less than half of the paper, and most of that focusing on arabs in a rather unpleasant light instead.
simply put, i know i've got asian blood, but i'm an american. i'm sure mineta seems himself as an american first, then one of asian origin. coulter, on the other hand, focuses entirely on the fact that he's asian, that he's "different", that he's "un-american". it's easier to paint someone as un-american when they don't look like they bake apple pies at home.

By your reaction, I think she's spot on. If this man in particular, was not Asian, would he have a job? The vehemence of your reaction seems to say that she's hit a sore spot.

If he is competent at his job, that is one thing, but it does no one any good to have someone who is incompetent, regardless of their race.

I'm still looking for the section that is 'racially charged.' It's not racist to accuse someone of being incompetent. Coulter is not saying that all Japanese are incompetent, just questioning why this man, in particular, has his job.

oh, please, ben. that's far from what she's saying. not only is she making such a big deal about his being a minority is because it's more ammunition. there are hundreds of ****ing ways to say the man's an incompetent buffoon without resorting to mentioning his ethnicity, his minority status.
the implication of what she's saying with that remark, when coupled with the other paragraphs, is that mineta, a democrat, and what's worse, a minority, is not only incompetent, but also a traitor whose exoticism makes him the perfect example of all of those foreigners who want to see america burn, and that's precisely why she laments the fact that he's not dead.

How well did the Japanese treat the Koreans and other Chinese?
To say that there is unity among 'asians' ignores the fact that they have treated each other far worse than the Americans and Canadians have treated the Asians. It doesn't excuse the US and Canada but to accuse the one of racism and not the other, ignores history.

the fact that the japanese were race supremacists does not excuse the fact that coulter linked an american of asian decent to something the japanese, who were not and are not americans, did.


the problem, ben, is not that the japanese did bad things, or that the americans did bad things. it's that someone who is quite clearly american is being painted as a foreigner and being linked to one of the most indelible atrocities committed by that foreign group. why? because both the group that committed the atrocities and the person in question were, at one point, long in the distant past, the same. the fact that my distant cousin murders sixty people does not make me a mass murderer, and it's a grave insult to link me to it for no better reason than the same last name.

Only mongoloids say 'zed'. There's your connection.

indians don't quite count as mongoloids. east asians, by and large, learn international americanized english, so those mongoloids don't say zed. as far as most retarded people, also mongoloid, who happen to live in america, don't say zed because it's hard enough to teach them the ****ing alphabet.

[Drake Tungsten]

east asians, by and large, learn international americanized english, so those mongoloids don't say zed.

Then why are my ****ing mongoloid students saying 'zed'?! It's all a ****ing conspiracy against me, I swear!

[Q Classic]

To say that there is unity among 'asians' ignores the fact that they have treated each other far worse than the Americans and Canadians have treated the Asians. It doesn't excuse the US and Canada but to accuse the one of racism and not the other, ignores history.

as far as this goes.

you also fall in to the same trap far too many non-asians do: that we're still foreign, even if we were american-born and raised having sucked down more coke and eaten more hamburgers than we have sticky rice and sake.

asian americans have no real history of mistreating each other. japanese americans never perpetrated mass acts of violence and racism against korean americans; chinese americans never tried to vandalize japanese american businesses. the same holds true for other groups too.

indeed, non-asians tend to see east asians as an undifferentiated mass. we're asked if we're brothers and sisters by curious imbeciles. we're asked if we know such-and-such because we happen to be of the same (or not) ethnicity. some of us are beaten to death because american jobs are being lost to overseas competition, even when our origins aren't from the same country--pretty much because we still look the same (Vincent Chin, anyone?).

besides, i fail to see how the fact that the japanese tried to stamp out all evidence of korean culture somehow mitigates the fact that the chinese american who worked on the railroads were treated little better than african american slaves. i fail to see how the disdain that the mutual asian races have towards each other makes the recurring american fear of the yellow peril any less worse.

as far as asian americans go, you're right. there's precious little that truly connects the various asian american groups together other than a common view that they're the minority nobody gives a **** about until they need to prove that minorities can actually make it on their own.
perhaps the only thing that really connects them is the conviction that we're all americans.
the saddest thing of all is that more often than not, we're not seen by others as american.

coulter's column merely drives that point home for many of us. that's why we find it so offensive, ben. that's why i find it so offensive.

[Q Classic]

Then why are my ****ing mongoloid students saying 'zed'?! It's all a ****ing conspiracy against me, I swear!

that's why they do it. it was in a meeting last year, actually. we're all supposed to say zed when we're around you.

[Theben]

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten

Don't be so full of yourself. Mexicans work harder than you.

Actually companies have been leaving Mexico for East Asia, b/c labor is cheaper and because Mexicans are supposedly not working as hard as they used to.

[Ben Kenobi]

oh, please, ben. that's far from what she's saying. not only is she making such a big deal about his being a minority is because it's more ammunition.

Again, who's the one making a big deal about his ethnicity? The folks who hired him just because he's Japanese? Or Ann Coulter for pointing that out? You ought to be praising her! She wants to end this special treatment, for the same reasons you are lambasting her, because she feels all Americans ought to be treated the same.

She doesn't want these differences to keep coming up, and so long as someone, who is incompetent, cannot be fired, because of his ethnicity, you will never be treated like an American.

there are hundreds of ****ing ways to say the man's an incompetent buffoon without resorting to mentioning his ethnicity, his minority status.

Fair enough. But why hasn't this man been turfed out if he is incompetent? That's the question Coulter's trying to hammer home.

Japanese, and minorities are given preferential quotas and hiring practices. The only way that these minorities will ever be treated like anyone else, is if these policies no longer exist.

mineta, a democrat, and what's worse, a minority, is not only incompetent, but also a traitor whose exoticism makes him the perfect example of all of those foreigners who want to see america burn, and that's precisely why she laments the fact that he's not dead.

Coulter does not say that she wishes that this fellow were dead. She's just saying that the current policy blows everything out of proportion. In emphasising the suffering of the Japanese-Americans who were interned, they ignore the suffering of the American soldiers on Bataan. She's spot on when she says this.

you also fall in to the same trap far too many non-asians do: that we're still foreign, even if we were american-born and raised having sucked down more coke and eaten more hamburgers than we have sticky rice and sake.

Oh, I'm treating you like a foreigner? I think you folks are just as much a part of your country if you were born here as those whose families have been here 3 or 4 generations.

I'm just sick and tired for getting blamed for racism in exposing the inherent racism imbued in preferential hiring practices.

the same holds true for other groups too.

No, that's not true. You may not beat each other up on a regular basis, but there is animosity between the various groups.

indeed, non-asians tend to see east asians as an undifferentiated mass.

And that's precisely the attitude I tried to combat. I know there are differences between the Chinese, and the Japanese, and the Koreans. I've seen them for myself. That's why I bring up Nanking.

So how about giving me a little credit rather than labelling me as the normal Gaijin?

the recurring american fear of the yellow peril any less worse.

What recurring american fear of the yellow peril? I fail to see any evidence of it's existence.

As for the slavery, particularly on the Canadian railroads, there is no excuse for that. However, if you want to bring up history and to blame a peoples for the actions of the past, then you need to take the Japanese to court for their atrocities as well.

The Americans and the Canadians should not shoulder the blame alone, yet they are always the ONLY ones held responsible for past atrocities, regardless of historical fact.

coulter's column merely drives that point home for many of us. that's why we find it so offensive, ben. that's why i find it so offensive.

Then you should thank her for rooting out incompetents who take advantage of racist hiring policies that divide Americans from one another, rather than shooting the messenger.

[KrazyHorse]

Summary?

[Ben Kenobi]

i don't care if you're supporting a conservative asian canadian, because what matters in that case is that he's canadian, not that he's asian. it doesn't matter one whit because you're not the one who would be branded as a foreigner based on your looks.

So who's fault is that? Me or society?

I can only be held responsible for my own actions, and not those of my society.

[Drake Tungsten]

that's why they do it. it was in a meeting last year, actually. we're all supposed to say zed when we're around you.

I KNEW IT!!!

Actually companies have been leaving Mexico for East Asia, b/c labor is cheaper and because Mexicans are supposedly not working as hard as they used to.

Don't burst my stereotype bubbles, Theben. Mexicans may indeed be as lazy as Puerto Ricans, but I don't want to know about it...

[Saint Marcus]

Coulter seems like a well known version of Gianfezlo.

[KrazyHorse]

That pretty much sums it up.

[Berzerker]

In emphasising the suffering of the Japanese-Americans who were interned, they ignore the suffering of the American soldiers on Bataan. She's spot on when she says this.

Who ignores it? Is Coulter arguing that every reference to the internment of Japanese Americans must include a reference to Bataan?

[KrazyHorse]

No, it's just that any wrong done by one group of people immediately absolves any wrong done against another group of people who look like the first group.

[Bosh]

Hmmmm love the people where O'Reilley talks about what he's hearing from military people he's talked to and Coulter comes back with "my military people are Rumsfeld."
Blech, what idiocy.