Who were the greatest defenders of all time?

[Dr Strangelove]

Originally posted by Ned
Well, Dr. Strangelove, whatever it was, and it probably was Bubonic Plague, the contrast between the state of the Empire in 542 and 610 is remarkable. The decline in power was the most dramatic imaginable. It had to be caused by disease.

OK. My old genetics text was unaware of that one, but it only killed half the population according to eMedicine . The plague of the 14th century killed about 40% of the population. Like I said before Europe recovered from the later within two generations. A single plague isn't enough to explain 900 years of decline.

[Dis]

some of you guys have mentioned the U.S. defending against Japan. I think one guy mentioned Midway.

The thing about that is we intercepted and cracked their code. This gave us an advantage.

[Ned]

Originally posted by Dr Strangelove


OK. My old genetics text was unaware of that one, but it only killed half the population according to eMedicine . The plague of the 14th century killed about 40% of the population. Like I said before Europe recovered from the later within two generations. A single plague isn't enough to explain 900 years of decline.

No, but what happend during the Empire's decline from 580 - 660 or so?

It was dismembered and almost completely overrun.

[Dr Strangelove]

Looking around the web I'm having a great deal of difficulty obtaining accurate estimates of the timeline of the bubonic plague during this time period. Some sources mention 476 as the possible onset, others 560. Some mark its conclusion at around 600, others consider it to have ended as late as 740.

The Slavs staged major assaults upon the Balkans portions of the empire after 560, even attempting to lay siege to Constantinople in 580 (I think). The muslims don't show up until later in the 7th century. What I don't know is what effect the plague had on these two groups. One source places the origin of the plague in Africa, spreading to Syria, Palestine, and Persia before striking Asia Minor and the Balkans region. If the slavs were attacking the Empire at the time when the plague was raging then they would have been as devastated as the Byzantines. Furthermore it is evident that the plague took a heavy toll in areas of the world from which the muslims drew their troops. As I said before populations can recover from major epidemics surprisingly quickly. Apparently the thinning of a population may allow improved survival of the young once the offending agent has passed. Perhaps the rate iof childhood death from other diseases goes down. One usual feature of the plague seems to be that once it hits an area it goes away for along tyime because it kills off the vector species of rat.

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by Dr Strangelove


OK. My old genetics text was unaware of that one, but it only killed half the population according to eMedicine . The plague of the 14th century killed about 40% of the population. Like I said before Europe recovered from the later within two generations. A single plague isn't enough to explain 900 years of decline.

Actually parts of Europe did not recover (in terms of reaching the same level of population pre-Black Death) until the 19th Century.

This was in part due to the unprecedented increases in urban population, improvements in agriculture and climate before the 14th Century.

[Whoha]

Originally posted by Dissident
some of you guys have mentioned the U.S. defending against Japan. I think one guy mentioned Midway.

The thing about that is we intercepted and cracked their code. This gave us an advantage.

not at the eariler fighting though

[Ted Striker]

I smell a medieval thread coming on. Let's talk about gout!

[Dr Strangelove]

Originally posted by molly bloom


Actually parts of Europe did not recover (in terms of reaching the same level of population pre-Black Death) until the 19th Century.

This was in part due to the unprecedented increases in urban population, improvements in agriculture and climate before the 14th Century.

The gross population recovered within 40 to 50 years. I honestly don't think that there were remarkable advances in agriculture within that time period.

[molly bloom]

Don't think you're right reopulation.

[Dis]

now why is it we don't have a thread titled: who were the greatest attackers of all time?

I would do it, but I'm not sure who all to include in the poll.

I nominate the Mongols. They did pretty good with the technology they had.

I would say the U.S. in March of 2003. but technology did most of the work.

[Henrik]

Greatest defenders?

Going to go with The knights on Rhodes and later Malta. I just finnished reading a book about them.

[Vince278]

I'd go with two Russian defences: The Battle of Stalingrad and the Siege of Leningrad. If I had to choose I'd give the edge to Leningrad: They held out for years against all odds.