So how come black people call each other ******?

[Caligastia]

Originally posted by Pax Africanus
If the Europeans would not have colonized we don't know what would have happened.

A pretty safe bet would be that things would have remained the same as they had been for the last 40,000 years.

[Arrian]

What a odd thread.

Kudos to Pax for sticking it out and actually discussing, instead of getting pissed and leaving.

-Arrian

[BeBMan]

Originally posted by Caligastia


A pretty safe bet would be that things would have remained the same as they had been for the last 40,000 years.

That's meaningless speculation. You cannot exactly foresee the development of an entire continent.

[Jac de Molay]

So blacks calling each other ****** are somehow "devaluing" the word, or taking power away from it?

Sorry, Im not buying it . If anything, the true meaning and impact of the word is trivialized, and not for the greater good of a people.

The young guys in the gym using it don't care one bit about devaluing the word; they're using it because they're favorite gangsta rappers use it, and losing perspective on its negative impact every time they use it.

Sorry, but you guys were talking about the slave trade. Carry on

[dainbramage20]

Pax. By No means am I racist or such. And By no Means do I intentionally intend to come off that way. I love all races and break bread with all of them. I simply dislike attitudes and attire and I dislike the popular culture embraced by african americans (and some others) influencing todays attitudes and dress in this area as it teach kids that there is no hope in this world and your only goal in life is to get rich or die tryin. No ambition to be something productive like a docter, None to be a lawyer, Not even a mechanic. Ive trained hundreds of African Americans at work. I can say without a doubt 98% of them dont stay. They have there priorities wrong. Some came in late smelling of marijuana, others just dont call. And yet others will lie right to your face despite the blame for a problem being solely in there hands.

Alot of African-Americans need help NOW. Not
tommorrow, not 2010, NOW. You need to catch up. You are in danger of being further marginalized politically and economically, not worth pandering too cause 60% dont even vote (gallup poll from 2000). Whatever idea's from the Left or Right I would like to hear them.

Of course back on topic. I dont use that word. Its disrespectful tho I hear african americans use that word alot. It doesnt bother me too much. As its an in-culture thing I guess. I wont get it cause im not inside the culture. Im so Damn white If I step outside in the sun for a tan, I get whiter.

[Pekka]

To the actual topic, I just think that the word ****** is used amongst some black people is because it's a slang word, close meaning to brother in a way. Historical meaning would be something like 'we are in the same boat', both black and both slaves. That's what I think about it, however I can't say this as a fact, being a dirty euro, you Americans know better than me.

I think people can say to friends what ever they want, if it is accepted by them. If my buddy says to me in a gym 'come on you ***** let's do it!' comparing to some punk saying it to me who I don't know it would be different. The stranger is not allowed to call me that in a way that is friendly. But my friend can call me that and still be friendly. Stranger CAN try that, but it's not funny most likely. Insults can be taken, as they are not meant to be insults, but from strangers, they are not in the same position to do that. So if a black person calls another black person nigga, it's really not my problem and if they both don't feel bad about it, why shouldn't they be able to do that. We can all think it's kind of stupid, but if they really feel like it, by all means go ahead.

[Caligastia]

Originally posted by BeBro
With the slight difference that the white societies at that time said they were enlightened and morally better than those uncivilized Barbs....

...as opposed to your typically humble african tribe?

[Caligastia]

Originally posted by BeBro


That's meaningless speculation. You cannot exactly foresee the development of an entire continent.

I didn't. I said it would be a pretty safe bet. The burden of proof is on you if you think things would have changed without the injection of whites into the equation.

[Bereta_Eder]

Originally posted by Jac de Molay
So blacks calling each other ****** are somehow "devaluing" the word, or taking power away from it?

Sorry, Im not buying it .

IMO that's exactly it. You see for whatever reason a group lives in surroundings not his own. There it comes face to face with racism from the one dominant group. Absorbing the racism in itself it makes its offensive meaning dissapear within said group.

In essence, there are no bad words, just bad people. I can call someone whatever. If he's my friend he knows I mean that as a appraoch/friendly word. If he's not my friend he knows I say that as a curse.

[MrBaggins]

Originally posted by Pekka
*SNIP*

I'd just like to point out that I consider the discussion of the N word by Finns one of the most potentially ironic and amusing topics yet, especially considering Finland is, in my experience a land of whiteness, not even counting the copious snow in winter.

No offense or anything... just an observation.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by David Floyd
I'm just not seeing how Africa, as a continent, or any individual country in Africa, would have been significantly better off without the slave trade.

People who don't know **** about Africa shouldn't take part in the debate ans should sit back and learn something. One hundred million Africans were taken from Africa during the centuries of the slave trade. What do you think that does to a society, to an economy. Almost every state collapsed under the onslaught of the slavers to feed America's insatiable appetite?

Why? Because, outside the U.S. slaves were regularly worked to death, because buying news slaves was cheaper than keeping your old ones alive. Imagine Auschwitz on a continental scale and you have the slave system of the Americas (excluding the English North American colonies).

Before the slave trade? Congo was a Cathollic country with an ambassador in Lisbon. Mali went on the largest most expensive Hadj in the history of Islam. They dumped so much gold in the Arab market that, Europeans started trading in the Middle East, bringing back spices and silks. This trip changed history.

If it weren't for European plunder of Africa (and India and China), those countries wouldn't be anywhere near so bad as they are today, an we wouldn't be anywhere near so rich?

[Caligastia]

Originally posted by Pekka
That's what I think about it, however I can't say this as a fact, being a dirty euro, you Americans know better than me.

[David Floyd]

mindseye,

David Floyd, when you argue that many blacks are better off today because their relatives came to the US as slaves, are you arguing that the end justifies the means?

As I've stated numerous times before, of course not - slavery was morally wrong.

che,

If it weren't for European plunder of Africa (and India and China), those countries wouldn't be anywhere near so bad as they are today, an we wouldn't be anywhere near so rich?

While I don't deny this would have had an impact, the fact still remains that Europe and the US would be far better places to live than Africa.

[Bereta_Eder]

Could we please not generalize? Europe did that Europe did the other. Specific countries did specific things. Not "Europe" Doesn't mean anything. Thanks.

[BeBMan]

Originally posted by Caligastia
The burden of proof is on you if you think things would have changed without the injection of whites into the equation.

No. I made no assumption how it would have developed because I think it is a waste of time to prove any long-term development that did obviously not happen. What you call "a safe bet" remains pure speculation. You cannot know what societal structures Africans had developed when the continent had been untouched by colonialization. Just because you see no signs that they developed similar structures like Europe before the colonization of Africa proves nothing about the possibility of later developments.