The Fwench.

[Tripledoc]

As Spiffor said the headscarf is worn, because the men are are scared that the women should attractive.

I see many young muslim women wearing a headscarf, and that kind of headscarf they wear do not make them any less attactive.

[Ming]

Originally posted by duke o' york
p_c: your continual use of the word "fwench" suggests that you're being a bit of a trat in this thwead.

I agree... I was going to close this troll based on the opening post... but it seems like a real discussion is being attempted.

But if this goes the troll route... it will be toast.

[duke o' york]

p_c: your continual use of the word "fwench" suggests that you're being a bit of a trat in this thwead.

[MrFun]

Duh, Tripledoc -- I'm not saying that women should be forced to wear the headscarf -- it should be their choice, and if they choose to wear it in public, they should not be discriminated against for doing so.

[Tripledoc]

Originally posted by MrFun
Believe it or not, wearing a headscarf is not opressive for women if they are willing to wear it, as part of their custom.

Young Muslims wear the headscarf in Europe because it gives them a sense of identity.

In Saudi Arabia last week a famous Saudi business woman, deliberately, took her headscarf off a bit so that it did not cover her hair completely. She railed aganist the oppression of women in Saudi Arabia, and her speech was met with thundeous applause by the many young Saudi women there. Naturally chaos ensued, and the religious clerics went nuts.

Now, in Saudi Arabia the women are figthing a battle to be more free.

In France a very little minority of religious fundamentalist women want to be free to wear the headscarf. Even though that freedom is a freedom which they are demanded to exercise according to the Koran.

How can you demand that people be free to wear the headscarf, yet not give them the freedom not to wear the headscarf?

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by Tripledoc
The headscarf is not about religious expression. It is a demand laid down in the Koran.

Not exactly.
The Kuran demands women not to look attractive. The precise garb is entirely a matter of tradition and interpretation. In Northern Africa, it is a simple headscarf, or even sometimes a bandana. In Afghanistan, it is the whole fricking burka. Yet, every religious zealot will tell you that's God's will.

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Tripledoc
Regarding freedom of religious expression.

The headscarf is not about religious expression. It is a demand laid down in the Koran.

So, for instance, I will now go and tell all women to shut up in congregations, because that is what the bible says. That is within my rights of religious expression.

I think I will go and stone my adulterous neighbours to death too.

Believe it or not, wearing a headscarf is not opressive for women if they are willing to wear it, as part of their custom.

[Tripledoc]

Regarding freedom of religious expression.

The headscarf is not about religious expression. It is a demand laid down in the Koran.

So, for instance, I will now go and tell all women to shut up in congregations, because that is what the bible says. That is within my rights of religious expression.

I think I will go and stone my adulterous neighbours to death too.

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by DinoDoc
Spiffor: Can you tell me who the Fwench are?

I have no idea. Maybe Carribean Frenchmen who have trouble pronouncing the "r" correctly?

Or maybe that's just another Rosbif lame word to depict our glorious people?

[MrFun]

So freedom of religious expression is not something to be respected?

that's lovely

[problem_child]

Originally posted by Tripledoc
About the point that many French Muslims are opposed to the headscarf ban. I don't know, but it seems to me that it is a vocal minority.

In any case the leading religious Sunni, who resides in Egypt, has said that the French are right on this issue. The Koran apparently don't say that Muslims must wear the headscarf in secular states.

So maybe the issue should be resolved between the Muslims and France.

I agree, and I feel unable to come to any opinion that does not reflect my own bigotisms regarding the religious. Apparently the hijab started out as a christian thing anyway, later adopted by some islamic cultures so... generally I think it'snot unreasonable to ask people to leave symbols at the school gate.

[DinoDoc]

Spiffor: Can you tell me who the Fwench are?

[Spiffor]

Stay Azazel, and let's have some fun at the expense of the Rosbif together :beer:

[Az]

Ahh, I get it, so you opened this thread to play with yourself?

Ok, I don't think I want to stay aroun for that. 'sides, it's not as if it has any real content. Just had to write that request so you'd refrain from making this error again.

Cheers.

[MrFun]

Re: The Fwench.

Originally posted by problem_child

I personally wouldn't want to put up with peoples religious-detritus cluttering up my kids school if I was a parent, and I don't think Faithful people really dig an intergrated multicultural society anyway, because by definition they are all narrow-minded judgmental intolerants who think everybody else is going to the lake of fire to burn for eternity when they die, whereas Faithful people are all personal friends with The Man, who happens to share their many political opinions and hang-ups.
Cecularism on the other hand is far more accomodating, even Saddam Hussein's Iraq allowed women the freedom to become doctors and lawyers (shame about all the raping)

Anyway my point is that the Fwench say that cecularism is inherent to the values of their constitution, and that if you want to live in Fwance you should embrace their cecularist ways, and I agree. I havent heard christians or jews complaing about not being able to wear religious stuff in schools, but many muslims are. I think that's unreasonable and would be tempted to say to them 'if you don't like it you should go live in a muslim theocracy, and if you came from a muslim theocracy before, and went to live in Fwance, perhaps you should ask why you did so, what kind of things make living in Fwance (with Fwench people) better then living in a theocracy?'

But saying that wouldn't be fair to muslim women who were born in Fwance, and who see the hijab as part of who they are.

So to sum up- I have no meaningful answers beyond the generic mindless bigotry that I show towards the Fwench and the Religious alike.

Yes -- apparently if you're being serious with this post, you are indeed, bigoted towards religious people.