Video of Today's suicide bombing - Jan 29th

[Sandman]

Given that the Israeli-Palestinian conflict is characterised by low casualties and massive levels of propaganda, I'd say that it's clear that both sides have an overwhelming interest in keeping the conflict going.

It's a piece of geopolitical theatre.

[Sikander]

Originally posted by Oncle Boris


Yup, I saw this one. As disgusting as I found it to be, I was partly relieved that at least those people were defending their country against a deliberate invader.

I don't think the children on the bus were much of a defense against the deliberate invader and murderer.

[Sikander]

Originally posted by paiktis22
Zylka don;t flatter yourself thinking I read what you posted. I stopped after the first line because you failed to answer to this simple fact: Pal casualties double that of Israelis. Maaaaaany more videos baby!

Make no mistake I kinda like you and I know we disagree on this issue (o lord!!! the world will come tumbling down) but this is a very simple point. If blood is what we're counting here then the Pal one is double that of Israelis. If practices for how this is doen is what we're talking about then that's another matter. Anyway I much preferd you when you were writing weird threahds but my conscience doesn't allow me to mock someone who's taken interests in politics and the world around them agreeing or not.

I wonder what the ratio is when one removes friendly fire incidents from the picture. The Israelis tend to operate in Palestinian areas and have decent fire discipline and operate in formations in order to minimize the possibility of their shooting their own people. The Pals seem to be only organized in small groups, and when there is an incursion tend to form circular firing formations around the Israelis.

[Sikander]

Originally posted by Ecthelion
Would there still be suicide bombings if Israel stopped exisiting?

Of course there would be. The existence of the world is a humiliation for the Arabs.

[Sikander]

Originally posted by Alexander's Horse
Suicide bombing is the culmination of 50 years of oppression. It's a cry for help, it's revenge, it's vengeance. It's young people who believe they have no future and no hope.

And the Zionists still don't get it?

Make a just PEACE now!

With whom, what? People who want to destroy your people and state? People who only want peace in order to prepare for the next war from a better postion?

[Alexander's Horse]

Originally posted by Sikander


With whom, what? People who want to destroy your people and state? People who only want peace in order to prepare for the next war from a better postion?

What you wrote applies very well to the Israelis if you know anything about the history since the 1940's - do some reading and then let's talk.

[GePap]

Originally posted by skywalker

Brilliant counterarguement! Kudos! It deserves a pulitzer! Genius in its pure form!

NO, in reality, pathetic. Its called spinning the numbers. Agaion, what does it tell you about the underlying conflict that a higher proportion of the Palestinians population has been killed than the Israeli? Just as much as knowing that a greater percentage of Israelis killed are civlians than amopng the palestinians.

YOU are making an utterly moronic argument. The POINT is that Israel exercises RESTRAINT and exerts at least a little effort to AVOID civilian casualties, whereas civilian casualties are the Palestinians' GOAL.

Ah, no. The point is that the distribution of power is such that the Israelis have the techonlogy to try to avoid too much colateral damage while the Palestinians are too weak to hit the IDF directly so they turn to attacking civilians. Suicide weaponms are the tools of the weak. If the palestinians had guided missiles and jet fighters and tanks they could be "nice" as well. They don't. The Palestinians attack civilians because they don't have the power in general to do otherwise.

[Alexander's Horse]

Originally posted by skywalker


Duh. OBVIOUSLY we aren't talking about "each and every Palestinian", but rather the terror groups.

I assume when you talk about terror groups you also include Jewish terror groups like The Stern Gang which terrorised Arab villages in the 1940's?

Interesting terror group that - at least 2 future Israeli Prime Ministers were associated with it.

If we're talking Middle East terror, Zionist terror groups wrote the book long, long ago.

[Kuciwalker]

Brilliant counterarguement! Kudos! It deserves a pulitzer! Genius in its pure form!
NO, in reality, pathetic. Its called spinning the numbers. Agaion, what does it tell you about the underlying conflict that a higher proportion of the Palestinians population has been killed than the Israeli? Just as much as knowing that a greater percentage of Israelis killed are civlians than amopng the palestinians.

No, the fact that a greater percentage of Palestinians are killed tells us two things - first, there are fewer Palestinians, and second, the Israelis are better at killing people. Neither of those indicts either side.

OTOH, the fact that a FAR greater percentage of Israelis killed are civilians than of Palestinians killed tells us one of two things: either the Palestinians are deliberately targetting civilians or they are expending less effort to avoid civilians casualties. We know the former to be true, but in fact either case shows that the Palestinians are worse than the Israelis.

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by Alexander's Horse


I assume when you talk about terror groups you also include Jewish terror groups like The Stern Gang which terrorised Arab villages in the 1940's?

Interesting terror group that - at least 2 future Israeli Prime Ministers were associated with it.

If we're talking Middle East terror, Zionist terror groups wrote the book long, long ago.

There are two sides - Israelis and Palestinians. Despite the fact that not ALL Israelis and not ALL Palestinians are involved, we use those terms because they are CONVENIENT.

[Kuciwalker]

Ah, no. The point is that the distribution of power is such that the Israelis have the techonlogy to try to avoid too much colateral damage while the Palestinians are too weak to hit the IDF directly so they turn to attacking civilians. Suicide weaponms are the tools of the weak. If the palestinians had guided missiles and jet fighters and tanks they could be "nice" as well. They don't. The Palestinians attack civilians because they don't have the power in general to do otherwise.

So if you are mean to me, and you're bigger than me, it's OK for me to beat up your little brother to get back at you?

[Alexander's Horse]

Originally posted by skywalker




There are two sides - Israelis and Palestinians. Despite the fact that not ALL Israelis and not ALL Palestinians are involved, we use those terms because they are CONVENIENT.

Convenient but misleading.

I happen to believe that there are people of goodwill on both sides and the majority of people be they Israeli or Palestinian want to live in peace with their neighbour.

[GePap]

Originally posted by skywalker
So if you are mean to me, and you're bigger than me, it's OK for me to beat up your little brother to get back at you?

Ah, what a wonderfuly mindless counterarguement!

But you must be of the "to understand is to condone" mentality.

Did I attach any value words? NO.

Do Palestinians terror organizations kill Israeli civilians becuase that is how they get their jollies? becuase they like drinking baby blood, or watching videos like this and high fiving? No. They view themslves as being in a war (as do the Israelis), but unlike Israel, they have no well equiped standing army capable to delivering a conventional knock out punch- so they turn to unconventional violence-aka, terrorist acts, which in theory break down the political will of the other side to wage the campaign (which is why ALL insurgencies or guerrila groups and so ofrth turn to terrorist attacks) and thus lea to eventual political victory.

Is this "right"? No. And given relaitve power, not only is it not morally condonable, but even in a cold minded amoral sense it is still idiotic becuase it will not deliver victory. But these groups will not accept Ghandian non-violence anymore than most people will.

[Kuciwalker]

But you must be of the "to understand is to condone" mentality.

Did I attach any value words? NO.

Do Palestinians terror organizations kill Israeli civilians becuase that is how they get their jollies? becuase they like drinking baby blood, or watching videos like this and high fiving? No. They view themslves as being in a war (as do the Israelis), but unlike Israel, they have no well equiped standing army capable to delivering a conventional knock out punch- so they turn to unconventional violence-aka, terrorist acts, which in theory break down the political will of the other side to wage the campaign (which is why ALL insurgencies or guerrila groups and so ofrth turn to terrorist attacks) and thus lea to eventual political victory.

Well, sorry then. You sure sounded like you were justifying them, not explaining. And no, I don't think "to understand is to condone".

[Jaguar]

I think it's a little funny that North Americans and Europeans believe that they understand anything at all about the Palestinian mindset.